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Nearly 200 people under observation after Irkutsk lab worker dies from plague

172 points · 126 comments · ericmay

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abnry · 1791169150 · focus · HN ↗
How often does this sort of thing happen? I'm guessing more than we think, either because we forget the news stories we read or because it isn't reported.
1. jmyeet · 1791169414 · focus · HN ↗
  Janet Parker was the last person to die of smallpox and, yes, she caught it in a lab [1].
  [1]: <a href="https://whyy.org/segments/the-tragic-case-of-smallpoxs-final-victim/" rel="nofollow">https://whyy.org/segments/the-tragic-case-of-smallpoxs-final...
2. dnautics · 1791170107 · focus · HN ↗
  There was a COVID 19 lab leak in Taiwan about a year into the pandemic
3. breadzeppelin__ · 1791170228 · focus · HN ↗
  Bubonic plague is known to be active in Colorado, I think there are a handful of cases each year
  1. dreamcompiler · 1791171883 · focus · HN ↗
    If you live in the Rocky Mountains try to avoid close contact with prairie dogs or animal carcasses and you'll be fine. If you catch it, get to a hospital quickly and take the antibiotics and you'll probably be fine. If you delay treatment you probably should use that time to get your affairs in order.
    fc417fc802 · 1791173552 · focus · HN ↗
    > avoid close contact with prairie dogs or animal carcasses and you'll be fine
    I thought at least fleas could transfer it between mammals?
  2. mdp2021 · 1791179013 · focus · HN ↗
    Endemic in Antananarivo (very many deaths per year), not sure about the rest of Madagascar.
4. mycall · 1791172994 · focus · HN ↗
  Also ask how much is this failed route procedures because organisms or viri of this variety won't continue without human sustainment which is prone to human failures...
helsinkiandrew · 1791169459 · focus · HN ↗
So breaks a test tube of live bacteria at an “anti-plague institute”, possible infects 100 colleagues, then when she developed plague like symptoms is taken to hospital and possibly infects 100 patients.
I think they need to investigate their safety protocols
> She reportedly told medical staff that she had accidentally broken a test tube containing live bacteria while collecting samples for testing.
> At least 197 people who may have had contact with her were reportedly placed under medical isolation, including more than 100 in hospital wards.
1. hliyan · 1791170463 · focus · HN ↗
  Was this a glass test tube? I understand why glass is probably the best material for the inner lining of containers that hold biological material, but I'm surprised that there aren't better solutions for hazardous material (e.g. an unbreakable, transparent polymer outer coating).
  1. doodlesdev · 1791172348 · focus · HN ↗
    [delayed]
    fc417fc802 · 1791173352 · focus · HN ↗
    Polymer coated glass is commonplace in chemistry labs for large containers of hazardous reagents held in storage. There's no chemical leaching concern because it's on the outside.
    If anything, disposable plastic test tubes are the norm in microbiology labs at this point. No need to autoclave because they come sterile and you throw them away after a single use.
    Plenty of plastic that's designed for it goes through the autoclave. For example micropipette tips.
    murkt · 1791178849 · focus · HN ↗
    Not sure that throwing away plastic tubes with samples of plague bacteria is a good idea
    jacquesm · 1791179937 · focus · HN ↗
    Disposing of and throwing away are two different things. Throwing away is a subclass of 'disposing of' and there are many other such subclasses including safe destruction, for instance by incineration.
    cluckindan · 1791180164 · focus · HN ↗
    That’s what the autoclave is for.
    [deleted] · 1791173489 · focus · HN ↗
    [deleted]
2. smsm42 · 1791172563 · focus · HN ↗
  [delayed]
  1. vintermann · 1791180667 · focus · HN ↗
    > That's Russia we're talking about. You can have 1000 protocols and people will ignore them anyway.
    Speaking as someone who has a part of their job convincing people to follow safety processes, this isn't a Russia thing, it's a human thing.
3. mkotlikov · 1791173297 · focus · HN ↗
  I don't think there is any actual evidence that it was a broken test tube because she would have started on prophylactic antibiotic treatment immediately.
  Luckily you need to be in close contact with someone already very sick to catch it. It's not silent transmission like COVID. But maybe there is something different about this outbreak?
  1. no-name-here · 1791176261 · focus · HN ↗
    > I don't think there is any actual evidence that it was a broken test tube
    What does this mean? The article we’re discussing says the woman who died told colleagues she broke a test tube.
    r721 · 1791177574 · focus · HN ↗
    >The article we’re discussing says the woman who died told colleagues she broke a test tube.
    The article links to a telegram post [1] as source, which links to another telegram post [2], which now has an update:
    >It is not known exactly how Darya Shipilova contracted the plague. Currently, the theory involving a broken test tube is the leading one, but there is no official confirmation or independent verification of this information.
    (Google-translated)
    [1] <a href="https://t.me/Govorit_NeMoskva/70406" rel="nofollow">https://t.me/Govorit_NeMoskva/70406
    [2] <a href="https://t.me/Baikal_People/16629" rel="nofollow">https://t.me/Baikal_People/16629
robmusial · 1791169542 · focus · HN ↗
I literally just finished Annie Jacobsen's book 'Biological War: A Scenario' last week where the central plot point is an accidental release of modified form of pneumonic plague from a lab in Siberia. Very coincidental timing, especially since it made me wonder how often labs like these have accidents and we never hear about them because it is cleaned up without issue.
1. DJBunnies · 1791170257 · focus · HN ↗
  How’d it turn out, are we boned?
  1. Betelbuddy · 1791170372 · focus · HN ↗
    Netflix ends up the series after Season 1, just after your are emotionally invested...
  2. robmusial · 1791170541 · focus · HN ↗
    No spoilers but Jacobsen's scenario books don't end with "and society came together, acted rationally, and solved the problem!"
2. gazpachotron · 1791170600 · focus · HN ↗
  [dead]
3. petcat · 1791170758 · focus · HN ↗
  > made me wonder how often labs like these have accidents and we never hear about them because it is cleaned up without issue.
  Did anyone ever confirm if the lab in Wuhan China was the originator of COVID? I remember that was a rumor but never heard if there was anything to it.
  1. mvlipwig · 1791171014 · focus · HN ↗
    It's difficult to say for sure, but the consensus is leaning towards zoonotic origin from a bat or pangolin in a wet market. (I'm not very well researched on this topic and don't have any formal background in it, so hedge accordingly)
    fsckboy · 1791174099 · focus · HN ↗
    there is zero evidence for zoonotic origin, and messages have been found and made public showing that the public proponents of a zoonotic origin hypothesis were in private saying "lab leak".
    <a href="https://archive.ph/WTsga" rel="nofollow">https://archive.ph/WTsga
    refulgentis · 1791175450 · focus · HN ↗
    This says there’s 0 evidence to claim it’s a lab leak, and plenty of evidence, literal contact tracing from the wet market. They took the lab leak seriously and were emotionally resonant with you and I, however, they must deal in facts when they write.
    SV_BubbleTime · 1791174191 · focus · HN ↗
    >but the consensus is leaning towards zoonotic origin from a bat or pangolin in a wet market
    I literally had to check the date on this post.
    Does anyone else remember when claiming it was a lab in China that leaked was “racist”… but “they eat tainted exotic animals at wet markets” was “the consensus”?
    Wild times!
    porkpies101 · 1791174814 · focus · HN ↗
    Yes. Eat pork from your local industrial pig farms.
    porkpies101 · 1791175058 · focus · HN ↗
    We should not be eating animals period
    fr2029 · 1791175960 · focus · HN ↗
    [dead]
    mightysashiman · 1791178998 · focus · HN ↗
    They are so tasty though
    refulgentis · 1791175324 · focus · HN ↗
    Calling it the “Chinavirus” was obviously racist and weird. It was an ex posto facto thing to claim saying it was a lab leak was racist. I’m sure someone said that, however, no one serious was nor was it a common position.
    somenameforme · 1791177078 · focus · HN ↗
    People immediately started suggesting that the idea to close the border to Chinese travelers was racist. After it happened you even had the ever-politicized Lancet jump in claiming that such actions were "anchored in fear, misinformation, racism, and xenophobia." [1]
    Similarly, you're referencing a name that was uncommonly used. People mostly called it the Wuhan Virus, which would be a far more typical name than "COVID-19". Major outbreaks are regularly named based on their origin: Spanish Flu, Hong Kong Flu, Middle Eastern Respiratory Syndrome (MERS), Ebola, West Nile Virus, Marburg Virus, Zika Virus, Mexican Swine Flu, etc.
    [1] - <a href="https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7133591/" rel="nofollow">https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7133591/
    happymellon · 1791179674 · focus · HN ↗
    > Major outbreaks are regularly named based on their origin: Spanish Flu
    <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu
    > The earliest probable cases were documented in March 1918 in Haskell County, Kansas, United States
    Oh.
    Yokolos · 1791180301 · focus · HN ↗
    Okay, what about all the other examples?
    somenameforme · 1791180662 · focus · HN ↗
    That's a bit misleading: "The outbreak did not originate in Spain,[49] but reporting did, due to wartime censorship in belligerent nations. Spain was a neutral country unconcerned with appearances of combat readiness, and without a wartime propaganda machine to prop up morale,[50][51] so its newspapers freely reported epidemic effects, making Spain the apparent locus of the epidemic.[52] The censorship was so effective that Spain's health officials were unaware its neighboring countries were similarly affected."
    In other words other countries were effectively censoring it out of existence owing to WW1. Spain didn't have such censorship/propaganda going on, and so was seen as the epicenter, even though it ultimately wasn't.
    [1] - <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Spanish_flu&oldid=42685098" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Spanish_flu&oldid...
    refulgentis · 1791180133 · focus · HN ↗
    They were right, closing borders with China doesn't stop the virus from spreading, there's no scientific basis for that claim.
    It's amazing how you had all those at the tip of your tongue, you are a gentleman scholar. A peer comment discusses where the Spanish Flu originated, and illustrates the gap between what you asked the LLM for and well, how humans think.
    The LLM also went a bit overboard with the Wuhan Virus thing, it's a response but it's hilariously out of context. It's so confused what you're asking for help with that it's giving "Ah, but, people didn't say the thing you said was bad, because it was bad. The politically correct version was Wuhan Virus." - thus validating exactly what I said, the Chinavirus version was weird and bad.
    ipaddr · 1791177365 · focus · HN ↗
    I don't the formula: place + virus is racist. Racism is a serious issue and shouldn't be labelled on things that aren't making judgement using someone's race.
    Normally city + virus using country + virus is incorrect. But to call it racist or transphobic or fascist would be an incorrect usage.
    dwattttt · 1791177982 · focus · HN ↗
    The Spanish Flu's first known case was in Kansas. French papers changed from calling it American Flu to Spanish Flu to avoid angering an ally (<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu#cite_note-fiction-57" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu#cite_note-fiction-...).
    Maybe place + virus isn't inherently racist, but it's been politically charged & exploited; best to put the combination down.
    Angostura · 1791178994 · focus · HN ↗
    > Does anyone else remember when claiming it was a lab in China that leaked was “racist”
    No. I remember it being called a conspiracy theory. And it still is.
  2. hansvm · 1791171080 · focus · HN ↗
    Last I saw, plausible, unconfirmed, nobody is willing/able to provide enough information to be able to confirm one way or another.
  3. lumost · 1791171119 · focus · HN ↗
    I recently heard a scientist use a phrase something along the lines of “when two extraordinarily improbably events occur together, there is probably a connection”.
    We’ll never know if the lab in Wuhan originated the virus. But it is awfully strange that the first patients of a novel pandemic coronavirus were workers at a lab conducting gain of function research on coronavirus.
    aliljet · 1791173122 · focus · HN ↗
    Were they first patients?
    jijji · 1791174307 · focus · HN ↗
    Well, according to some reports, the first reported incidents happened in November 2019 and the months prior, from people who worked at Wuhan Institute of Virology (according to US government sources) [0].
    [0] <a href="https://www.public.news/p/first-people-sickened-by-covid-19" rel="nofollow">https://www.public.news/p/first-people-sickened-by-covid-19
    soganess · 1791175376 · focus · HN ↗
    Not according to them and this little-know publication called "Science." I've never heard of it, but seems legit:
    <a href="https://www.science.org/content/article/ridiculous-says-chinese-scientist-accused-being-pandemic-s-patient-zero" rel="nofollow">https://www.science.org/content/article/ridiculous-says-chin...
    jijji · 1791175537 · focus · HN ↗
    yes of course they all denied ever being sick in November 2019. China even denied that the wet market was the original source of infection. China also disputed any claims that they practiced "gain of function" research at all at WIV, even though that was uncovered by the recent evidence presented in Congress against Anthony Fauci, who funded the whole thing in the first place. So sure believe what you'd like. Maybe it came from a bat in a cave naturally, right? That is what China is claiming.
    soganess · 1791175662 · focus · HN ↗
    Yes, of course, the absence of evidence is always evidence of a cover up.
    jijji · 1791176334 · focus · HN ↗
    If you watched the Anthony Fauci evidence presented at Congress on July 29, 2026, where he pleaded the fifth 111 times during his testimony, it sure does sound like a really bad job at a cover up. [0]
    [0] <a href="https://www.youtube.com/live/_XgBX6qvnCY" rel="nofollow">https://www.youtube.com/live/_XgBX6qvnCY
    panja · 1791177126 · focus · HN ↗
    He has a target on his head. I would do the same, and pretty much any lawyer would recommend the same.
    jolux · 1791178273 · focus · HN ↗
    Treating pleading the Fifth as evidence of guilt is exactly the kind of unfairness the Fifth Amendment is meant to protect against.
    happosai · 1791176813 · focus · HN ↗
    According to partisan online newsletter "public.news" that claims to have interviewed anonymous US government sources.
    Unfortunately online search has gone useless and it's not possible to find out if anyone ever confirmed anything about that report. Just gazillion of other newslets repeating the original claim.
    bulbar · 1791177221 · focus · HN ↗
    Normally, I would count that as a strong signal that the origin was said lab. But with the current government, I don't think such a report in isolation should be considered as strong evidence. The US is not trustworthy at the moment.
    tzs · 1791177661 · focus · HN ↗
    That is all based on the claim that they had illnesses with symptoms consistent with COVID. But those are also consistent with the flu and with the common cold and with other seasonal viruses which were also active at the time, since November is in the respiratory illness season there.
    cma · 1791173182 · focus · HN ↗
    Source on first patients being WIV workers? I think there was a US intelligence report that claimed several fell ill in Nov., some with incompatible symptoms, and with claims from WIV they didn't test positive for antibodies (not saying take those at face value). There's also the wet market and the sampling done in gutters around the different stalls and a whole competing story there, which is also the kind of scenario in the 2002 SARS outbreak.
    fsckboy · 1791173521 · focus · HN ↗
    >...were workers at a lab conducting gain of function research on coronavirus...
    ...with funding from a US group that discussed conducting this gain of function research in China using a spike protein at the furin cleavage site, a group whose members were appointed to come up with an explanation for what had happened.
    tzs · 1791175568 · focus · HN ↗
    Virus outbreaks are usually first recognized in large cities. Most large Chinese cities have labs that study coronaviruses. They were established in response to SARS-CoV-1 in the early 2000s.
    So no matter where it comes from the chances are good a coronavirus outbreak will first be detected in a city that has a coronavirus lab.
    lumost · 1791177043 · focus · HN ↗
    My understanding is that the Wuhan Institute of Virology was one of only 2 BSL-4 labs in china in 2019, and the only one focused on emergent viruses. This is out of 684 major Chinese cities.
    hypfer · 1791179257 · focus · HN ↗
    The good thing about free will is that one can just believe that something is true, regardless of how much people on the web hit oneself over the head for it.
    Ideally, said belief is rooted in scientific methods, of course.
    But there is actually no need for this "lab! No! Market! no! Lab!" ping-pong that seems to be developing here.
    siva7 · 1791178886 · focus · HN ↗
    You seem to deliberately mislead readers...
    ANarrativeApe · 1791177642 · focus · HN ↗
    Beyond reasonable doubt doesn't mean impossible,any more than on the balance of probabilities means beyond reasonable doubt.
    Angostura · 1791178768 · focus · HN ↗
    > But it is awfully strange that the first patients of a novel pandemic coronavirus were workers at a lab conducting gain of function research on coronavirus.
    Except - as far as I know - the first patients weren’t.
    happymellon · 1791179086 · focus · HN ↗
    > I recently heard a scientist use a phrase something along the lines of “when two extraordinarily improbably events occur together, there is probably a connection”.
    Dumbest thing I've heard today.
    Ever since we started studying autism, we found it! Therefore studying causes autism.
    fragmede · 1791180536 · focus · HN ↗
    I might not have been the best student, but I wouldn't call studying "extraordinarily improbable".
    jacobolus · 1791180431 · focus · HN ↗
    This is not an accurate description. The first identified patients were people working in or living near a "wet market" where (among other things) various wild animals were sold.
    It's not unusual that there were labs working on coronavirus research in multiple major Chinese cities: the 2002 SARS outbreak, which began in southern China, led to significant investment in the study of coronaviruses.
  4. chihuahua · 1791171312 · focus · HN ↗
    All the evidence was destroyed, so it can't be proven either way. Probably just a coincidence.
  5. felixg3 · 1791171322 · focus · HN ↗
    Pretty much confirmed by western intelligence including the German BND
    gruez · 1791171685 · focus · HN ↗
    Source?
    theoreticalmal · 1791172291 · focus · HN ↗
    Copy and paste this into Google: Wuhan lab leak fbi
    MitziMoto · 1791172758 · focus · HN ↗
    Ah, the old "Do your research!".
    tzs · 1791176243 · focus · HN ↗
    The results show they said this was low confidence, and the results will also turn up that other US government agencies came to the opposite conclusion, also with low confidence.
  6. alexnewman · 1791171421 · focus · HN ↗
    I get downvoted every time I say this but the evidence doesn’t even prove it started in wuhan, or even China. It could of easily been brought here by the military games that happened before that
    theoreticalmal · 1791172345 · focus · HN ↗
    Do you have any thoughts as to why the FBI disagrees with your perspective?
    <a href="https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-64806903" rel="nofollow">https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-64806903
    bix6 · 1791172825 · focus · HN ↗
    I don’t but this guy in your article does
    > A natural origin is still the more likely theory, said Professor David Robertson, head of viral genomics and bioinformatics at University of Glasgow.
    ericmay · 1791173092 · focus · HN ↗
    So the suggestion is that it occurred naturally in China and then military games happened near Wuhan which spread the virus? Or did someone from Wuhan with ties/service in the Chinese military contract the virus locally and then spread it throughout China via travel to these military games?
    Is that right, or is your point simply that it naturally occurred in China in the vicinity of Wuhan? I ask since the OP mentioned military games.
    alexnewman · 1791173240 · focus · HN ↗
    They don’t disagree. They don’t know. They just said what’s most likely. They don’t even give a %
    toast0 · 1791174820 · focus · HN ↗
    Is the US FBI a credible investigator for something like this?
    a) I don't know that they have the right skills to track down patient zero of a disease.
    b) They certainly don't have jurisdiction to do such an investigation in a foreign country, unless invited, and there's no way they were invited.
    I strongly doubt we'll ever see a good answer on this, unless we get very lucky and some random research sample is looked at later that shows detection months earlier in a different location or if the Chinese did a good investigation and kept it quiet, but it leaks in a couple decades.
    A timely and thorough investigation might have been able to determine an origin, but the US FBI certainly didn't do one.
    junofan · 1791176665 · focus · HN ↗
    The US can just declare extraterritorial jurisdiction. We do it for bioweapons. Uncle Sam doesn’t need an invite.
    IIRC one of the FBI guys who investigated anthrax was like “yeah, it’s pretty obvious looking at what that lab was up to.”
    tzs · 1791176362 · focus · HN ↗
    Your link also says
    >> And other US government agencies have drawn differing conclusions to the FBI's.
  7. potatoproduct · 1791172116 · focus · HN ↗
    Chinas actions following the event includes the destruction of evidence, refusal of access and using the WHO as their personal mouthpiece. Unless history is rewritten too, every textbook should clearly point to China.
    vachina · 1791172796 · focus · HN ↗
    Source? Your account is no better hearsay.
    sudo_cowsay · 1791173060 · focus · HN ↗
    ur username?
    nxm · 1791173691 · focus · HN ↗
    It’s clear that they knew about the extent of the issue weeks earlier and tried to contain it, rather than letting the world know
    vintermann · 1791179742 · focus · HN ↗
    I agree it's clear they knew something was up and tried to control information getting out.
    But that's not at all enough evidence that they knew about the extent of the issue. Such institutions reflexively try to control information flow whether they themselves know what's going on or not.
    ruficufi274 · 1791173665 · focus · HN ↗
    now do NIH / Doge / Twitter
    khazhoux · 1791176153 · focus · HN ↗
    Objection: relevance.
    ididndn · 1791179268 · focus · HN ↗
    removal of evidence
    avidiax · 1791176884 · focus · HN ↗
    I feel it's more complicated than that. I wouldn't be surprise if Beijing does not actually know whether this was a lab leak or not.
    The local government might know. They would have started a cover up reflexively.
    But in either case, it could be that neither the local government nor central government wants to know or to find out. Ultimately, destroying the evidence and failing to cooperate with foreign investigators has cost China very little or nothing, even.
    In short, I feel China should be admonished for covering things up, but not that the cover up proves the lab leak.
    adventured · 1791179785 · focus · HN ↗
    There's no scenario where a local government knows whether it was a leak or not, and Beijing is kept in the dark. The fear local governments feel when it comes to being subservient to Beijing would entirely rule out hiding anything from them about what actually happened.
    vintermann · 1791179530 · focus · HN ↗
    In a state like China, this would probably happen as a panic response, not because the people covering up and destroying evidence know that their institution has done something bad/embarrassing, but because they fear it might be so and it's far better for their personal careers to suppress too much than to suppress too little. It's quite possible the people running cover-ups knew as little as us.
    And that goes for western spy agencies too, by the way. Headless chickens all around.
  8. thelastgallon · 1791176324 · focus · HN ↗
    Bill Gurley has a presentation about it, asking questions: <a href="https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49765794">https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49765794
  9. khazhoux · 1791176436 · focus · HN ↗
    Well, Americans were essentially prohibited from discussing this (most obvious) possibility because of fears that doing so would incite racist feelings towards Chinese people.
    Then it was made worse by Trump's insistence on calling it the Chinavirus (just to make it "not my fault!") and predictably then the anti-Trump left reacted by censoring any connection between the lab and the outbreak.
  10. qznc · 1791177373 · focus · HN ↗
    I believe it was zoonosis, not a lab leak: <a href="https://marketwise.substack.com/p/did-covid-19-come-from-a-lab-the" rel="nofollow">https://marketwise.substack.com/p/did-covid-19-come-from-a-l...
  11. TacticalCoder · 1791177423 · focus · HN ↗
    > Did anyone ever confirm if the lab in Wuhan China was the originator of COVID? I remember that was a rumor but never heard if there was anything to it.
    Official report mandated by US Congress (under Biden btw): says it's likely it's a lab leak of a modified virus. CIA also changed its official stance and consider it's likely a lab leak.
    The international expert who everybody based its idea that "it cannot possibly be a lab leak" has been debarred and cannot ever get funding from the US for research on modified viruses.
    To me there's "something" off and it is a lab leak. And I always felt like this.
    kennywinker · 1791177880 · focus · HN ↗
    > And I always felt like this.
    Hence you looked for evidence that matched and dismissed evidence that doesn't match.
    Unless you can tell me that the majority of virologists agree it was a lab leak, I'm going to go with their majority opinion - which last I checked was that it couldn't possibly be a lab leak for specific genetic reasons.
    happymellon · 1791179955 · focus · HN ↗
    > cannot ever get funding from the US for research on modified viruses.
    So a guy who disagreed with the official CIA stance has been barred from obtaining funding for research from the US.
    I mean, that just makes them seem more trustworthy.
  12. matt123456789 · 1791178735 · focus · HN ↗
    That was exactly the strain of Coronavirus that the lab was working with, and exactly the kinds of mutations you'd expect them to make.
    But no, I'm sure it was the wombats.
    hypfer · 1791179591 · focus · HN ↗
    The english indie rock band that formed in liverpool in 2003 did covid-19?
  13. vintermann · 1791179026 · focus · HN ↗
    There was endless discussion about how unlikely or reasonable it was with furin cleavage sites and whatnot. I wouldn't trust authoritative summaries.
4. Mobius01 · 1791173635 · focus · HN ↗
  How did you enjoy the book? I did like her nuclear war volume, but it could have used some editing.
  1. aworks · 1791174515 · focus · HN ↗
    I preferred the Nuclear War scenario book. Same style of narrative mixed with expert insights. The first several days of the scenario were riveting, after that less so. This one tries to describe the impact of social media and influencers, which I found inconclusive.
    She also reports that Bush rode in the back of a laundry truck on the day of 9/11 to avoid detection getting to the Doomsday plane. Single source attribution, though.
  2. robmusial · 1791176533 · focus · HN ↗
    I thought it was better than the Nuclear war scenario, which I also enjoyed. I thought she did a better job in this one explaining possible off ramps or inflection points in the scenario but saying "this is the one we're exploring", which answers some of the critique of the nuclear war scenario.
hn_throwaway_99 · 1791169586 · focus · HN ↗
> The woman was identified as Daria Sh., a 27- or 28-year-old employee of the Irkutsk anti-plague institute, by the exiled news outlet Lyudi Baikala (People of Baikal) and pro-Kremlin broadcaster REN TV.
> She reportedly told medical staff that she had accidentally broken a test tube containing live bacteria while collecting samples for testing.
This is just weird. Plague is easily treated if antibiotics are given right away. I'm shocked that an anti-plague institute wouldn't have detailed and proactive plans in case of mishaps. Obviously I think it's likely that there is more to it than what's reported in the article, but I would find it truly baffling if within 60 seconds of her breaking that test tube that protocols weren't initiated to protect her, her colleagues and the community.
Of course, Russia...
1. mrkstu · 1791171899 · focus · HN ↗
  I'm assuming if its a bio-lab that its a gain of function version that may be immune to conventional antibiotics.
  Actually went to a scout camp as a teenager (in the 80s) and one of our scouts got the plauge. Took a long while for the hospital to identify it and get him on heavy antibiotics because no one had seen it in real life before.
  1. mycall · 1791173274 · focus · HN ↗
    Hopefully long while is under 24 hours like this plague is.
2. smsm42 · 1791172982 · focus · HN ↗
  [delayed]
  1. jacquesm · 1791180219 · focus · HN ↗
    Interesting theory.
3. kgeist · 1791173060 · focus · HN ↗
  It's not clear if she even died from plague. The Russian-language version of the article lists various "versions" of what happened, and her breaking a test tube is only listed as one of the versions. Sounds like random rumors but at the same time, you can't trust the government either (which says no one has tested for plague positively). What's clear is that an employee at an "anti-plague' institute suddenly died from pneumonia-like symptoms, which certainly sounds suspicious but interpreting it as evidence of a plague infection may also be an overreaction
4. bitwize · 1791174369 · focus · HN ↗
  "Don't worry, Mikhail. We have extensive containment measures in place. In case pathogen breaks containment, detachment of troops stands ready to terminate all remaining personnel and burn facility to ground."
  "But sir, you are talking about—"
  "I am talking about courageous scientists giving their lives to protect Mother Russia. Any further questions?"
5. poilcn · 1791175543 · focus · HN ↗
  >the exiled news outlet
  i wouldn't rely as a source of information on some very niche outlet whose stuff located thousands kms from the place where something happens
  > REN TV.
  these are guys whose bread and butter are paranormal activity and UFOs
aaron695 · 1791171389 · focus · HN ↗
[dead]
chasil · 1791173102 · focus · HN ↗
Yersinia Pestis is normally cured with doxycycline, cipro, or streptomycin.
Is this a resistant strain?
<a href="https://emedicine.medscape.com/article/235627-medication#1" rel="nofollow">https://emedicine.medscape.com/article/235627-medication#1
1. cyberax · 1791179812 · focus · HN ↗
  Unfortunately, even prompt antibiotics don't always help with the pneumonic form.
r721 · 1791174551 · focus · HN ↗
>Oct. 2
Here's a newer CNN story from today:
>Researcher at Russian plague laboratory dies of ‘unknown’ infection
<a href="https://edition.cnn.com/2026/10/04/europe/russia-laboratory-plague-accident-intl" rel="nofollow">https://edition.cnn.com/2026/10/04/europe/russia-laboratory-...
This post from local Irkutsk region media is also interesting:
<a href="https://t.me/Baikal_People/16651" rel="nofollow">https://t.me/Baikal_People/16651 (in Russian)
ungreased0675 · 1791174597 · focus · HN ↗
Are we fairly confident that these labs do more good than the risk they present to the public? I’m not sure we should be keeping dangerous pathogens around just for giggles and PhD papers. What are examples of how the research done in these places improves public health?
1. vincnetas · 1791174709 · focus · HN ↗
  knowledge. how to handle that and how it looks/works. if you forget it you will be reminded later.
  1. ungreased0675 · 1791175043 · focus · HN ↗
    You’re describing documentation though.
    asdfsa32 · 1791175764 · focus · HN ↗
    There is far more knowhow and supply chain that goes into keeping labs working than just documentation. Also, research requires labs, and so it is kind of already there sort of thing.
2. ashdksnndck · 1791178020 · focus · HN ↗
  People are downvoting like asking the question is a thoughtcrime or something. It’s a legitimate line of inquiry. Research happens because somebody is interested and writes a grant request that is accepted. Governments and institutions where the research happens have rules as well. It’s possible that the researchers, the folks reviewing the grants, and the people making the rules haven’t don’t a cost-benefit analysis that adequately covers the tail risks. For some kinds of research, the answer can be no, it’s not worth it. It’s reasonable to publicly discuss these concerns.
3. cyberax · 1791179241 · focus · HN ↗
  Plague exists naturally. It's not some kind of a movie-land bioweapon McGuffin. The US has half a dozen cases of plague each year.
  Russia did a lot of work to control the plague with anti-plague vaccinations of cattle and pets, resulting in almost no human plague cases. This obviously requires research and development for vaccines.
  BTW, same applies to anthrax. It also exists naturally, which surprises a lot of people.
4. dehrmann · 1791180359 · focus · HN ↗
  For all the hand wringing we're doing over AI, I'm surprised that post-covid, regardless of origin, there wasn't a more serious discussion on what sorts of biological research are worth the risk.
poilcn · 1791175159 · focus · HN ↗
This information that she "broke a tube" is tabloid bs.
Non-tabloid version is that she didn't catch it in the lab, she got ill "while being on a research trip to Buryatia region near the border where sources of the disease were found".
1. no-name-here · 1791176388 · focus · HN ↗
  OP article claims the former. Is there a better source for the latter?
  1. amdsn · 1791178212 · focus · HN ↗
    So far I have seen claims of her contracting it doing fieldwork in Buryatia only in telegram groups with no sources. The head of Buryatia Tsydenov released a statement saying she had not been there and that the republic doesn't have animals that carry it.
TZubiri · 1791175971 · focus · HN ↗
>Irkutsk region Governor Igor Kobzev urged the public to remain calm after meeting with Rospotrebnadzor chief Anna Popova to coordinate emergency containment measures.
>“All identified contact persons have been placed under medical observation. As of today, the contacts show no signs of illness, and their laboratory test results are negative,”
Why is the knee jerk reaction of authority figures to say everything is fine? Be it epidemic risk, or cybersecurity incidents, the spokepeople always output noise in the form of "everything is fine", there's almost no signal
1. pferde · 1791180615 · focus · HN ↗
  Because admitting there are problems causes the market prices to go down.
Freedom2 · 1791176179 · focus · HN ↗
Thankfully I still have a decent supply of ivermectin from HNs guidance during COVID.
1. mdp2021 · 1791179534 · focus · HN ↗
  What a lousy summary of the lousiest years.
  The antiscientific, ventral, paternalistic-in-democracy (an absurdity) attitude had been systemic.
  Now back to the topic.
chvid · 1791177261 · focus · HN ↗
Sounds cartoon-like and unbelievable.

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