Thread

1. atoav · 1791104660 · focus · HN ↗

   If every building and other piece of infrastructure essentially powers itself, that means to disable a bunch of targets you now can't just disable a central substation that feeds them, you have to disable the targets themselves, and depending on the nature of the targets that may no longer be economical.

   It also no longer makes sense to attack the connecting lines between them as well.

   1. gnull · 1791106665 · focus · HN ↗

      Disabling them is a means to deal economic damage, not an end-goal in itself.

      People built centralized grids because it's cheaper to build and service when the equipment is concentrated in one place. The economy of scale kicks in.

      If you move to decentralized so there's fewer outages, but now you're paying extra to maintain it, your solution is not as good as it used to be, that's economic damage right there.

      And your enemy probably will also stop targeting the small decentralized grid elements, so they're not spending bucks on missiles. They can use more of them to hit other parts of your economy that are still centralized.

      Estimating the net impact of this change is bigger than the article suggests.

      1. astine · 1791111748 · focus · HN ↗

         > Disabling them is a means to deal economic damage, not an end-goal in itself.

         Russia's goal in attacking Ukraine's energy sector is to make the country ungovernable. They attack the energy sector in winter because they know that causes suffering and hope that will cause the populace to turn against their government or at least against the war. It's not just a matter of causing economic damage, turning off the heat is a means to an end in ending the war in their favor.

         1. bluGill · 1791114720 · focus · HN ↗

            That is a stated goal but it's repeatedly happened through history that someone has attempted to do that same thing and what it really did was make the population even more eager to go to war to defeat you.

            1. codedokode · 1791120883 · focus · HN ↗

               But isn't West getting tired of war? For example, in Germany, an "Alternative for Germany" is winning which calls for making a deal with Russia to get the cheap energy and stop supporting the war. West thought that Russian economy would crumble under sanctions, but instead it seems that Western economies are not doing great, and the West has depleted its ammunition reserves due to the war in the Middle East.

               1. bluGill · 1791121255 · focus · HN ↗

                  Ukraine is the one being attacked here, not Germany. I am not sure what your point is. Certainly, Europe in general is tired of the war. Western Europe has been against war in general for a long time. That's not necessarily a sign that they're going to stop supporting Ukraine. Different countries, of course, will do different things, but overall, signs are, while Europe is tired of war and wants it to end, Europe is not willing to end it on Russia's terms. We will see countries have been flowed their support for Ukraine, but I would say overall all signs are Europe is still going to continue supporting Ukraine in the war for the foreseeable future. Only time will tell, but that's my current read of the situation.
               2. Paradigma11 · 1791189013 · focus · HN ↗

                  Most polls in the EU show around 60% support for military assistance to Ukraine. People are fed up with many things and opposition parties are more likely to be pro Russian to get that vote. If anything the last years have shown Russia's true face and I don't think there is much appetite for renewing those business deals which have been shown to be such a dangerous dependency.

Unofficial Hacker News client; not affiliated with Y Combinator.