Thread

1. jwally · 1790684914 · focus · HN ↗

   I was thinking about this with flock cameras the other day...what's our actual ROI? Was the world horrible before and these initiatives are going to close a monster crime gap or is this just a giant fishing expedition ... just because?

   1. pj_mukh · 1790688931 · focus · HN ↗

      Can we cut to the bone a little bit? The recent crime panics are not about a partner assaulting their live-in partner or a random home burglary. There is no real "ROI" to be had.

      It's purely about the unease of living in chaotic cities, the random stabbings, the shoplifting, the visible homelessness etc. Flock is the stopgap here.

      Partly the "feeling" of chaos is just that, a feeling, driven significantly by algorithmic feeds feeding us every random crime from around the country 24/7. Husband murders wife in a murderous rage? No one hear's about it. Mentally ill man murders a woman on the train in a Tier 2 city, immediate nationwide breaking news.

      The other part though is a real dissolution in how we take care of our mentally ill. Complex topic [1].

      I think complaining about Flock is complaining about the symptom. Today we dogpile on Flock to get it cancelled, tomorrow the public will reach for something else. We have to fix the underlying disease, which is a combination of the two factors above.

      [1]: <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;time.com&#x2F;6265241&#x2F;america-care-of-mentally-ill-people&#x2F;" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;time.com&#x2F;6265241&#x2F;america-care-of-mentally-ill-people...

      1. thinkingtoilet · 1790690611 · focus · HN ↗

         Let us also acknowledged that we&#x27;re living in the safest time in history and modern American cities are extremely safe, despite the unhinged propaganda from the right.

         1. pj_mukh · 1790691048 · focus · HN ↗

            The usual retort here is that the anxiety driving the adoption of Flock can&#x27;t be seen in crime statistics (which is mostly measuring partner&#x2F;family crimes ala &quot;murder rate is down&quot;).

            The random smattering of shoplifting is never reported, the unhoused man in a fit of rage yelling at passers-by is never filed with the police. But in the privacy of the voting booth, people will vote for more Flock cameras.

            Instead of waving off concerns we should be addressing them better.

            1. thinkingtoilet · 1790691989 · focus · HN ↗

               We can&#x27;t address concerns if they aren&#x27;t based in reality.

               &quot;the unhoused man in a fit of rage yelling at passers-by is never filed with the police&quot;

               Good. That&#x27;s not a crime.

               1. pbhjpbhj · 1790694716 · focus · HN ↗

                  I don&#x27;t disagree, but reflecting solely on your comment, I wonder if we should try and capture&#x2F;record such disorder as a preliminary step to coming up with better ways to tackle it?

                  It probably loops back to better mental health care provision? But might also relate to provision of social housing? Or any number of things. These sorts of indicators can feed into a &#x27;gross happiness quotient&#x27; to help us focus on improving society for all of us, not just feeding the greed of the billionaires which a lot of Western society seems to be subservient to right now.

                  1. hobofan · 1790696014 · focus · HN ↗

                     But why is there a need to measure it in the first place and then only react to it?

                     You already came to the proper conclusion by just thinking about it for a few minutes. Let&#x27;s just skip building out a surveillance state, and put that money directly into mental health &amp; housing initiatives instead.

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