Thread

1. alexandre_m · 1790644533 · focus · HN ↗

   > while young people are drinking less alcohol due to health and financial concerns

   My observation is that gen-z spends less time socializing in real life, and drinking remains a social habit for the most part at a younger age. While they drink less, cannabis, vaping and psychedelics are on the rise.

   It's a nice claim to say they are more responsible, but it tells an incomplete story.

   1. silisili · 1790649905 · focus · HN ↗

      That's what big tech wanted, looks like they succeeded. Hard to shove targeted ads into the eyeballs of people socializing with one another.

      1. teitoklien · 1790650628 · focus · HN ↗

         since when did everyone, ditch personal responsibility to the drain ? I understand that social media platforms are hardcore unethical with the way they prioritize screentime and addiction

         Over our wellbeing even at the cost of knowingly decreasing our attention spans with all the Shorts / Tiktok Algorithms.

         But we must also take personal responsibility, it costed me $2 (/year) to buy a screen time addiction removal app that works for my iPhone, iPad and even my linux machine with firefox browser, and to lock down every damn social media app in both intervention and absolute blocking ways, and it worked great !

         I moved from a screen time addiction of 9h / day to just using my phone in total for 2h out of which most of that is Phone Calls, Apple Music, and Booking Ubers. I was able to set free, and my life was better for it, because of my personal responsibility towards my own life.

         It doesnt cost much / almost nothing, to reclaim your life back, there will always be people / organizations trying to screw you over, they have always existed since time millenium , be it corrupt empires, cults and anti-social religions, horrible food, bad peer pressure in school leading to poor influence, bad habits picked up from parents/elders in a kid's life.

         The only consistent way that humans have been able to survive, thrive and personally excel in their own lives, against all odds of their society, family, and their sorroundings.

         Is PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. I sometimes feel many of us have given up on any outlook of fixing ourselves, i see it with my friends and my loved ones too, we have to make personal responsibility, popular again, if we want a better future.

         1. landdate · 1790650906 · focus · HN ↗

            Classic "personal responsibility" argument used to subjegate the masses.

            Individuals have personal responsibility, but the behaviour of a group of humans regresses towards the mean as it gets larger.

            You can't assume someone will get fat just because you offer highly addictive processwd food, but you can assume the population as a whlle will.

            1. teitoklien · 1790652337 · focus · HN ↗

               You mistook what I said, for saying nothing needs to be done regulatory, and everything is ok.

               What I said is, dont wait, for the government to come save you, regulations take a lot of time to happen, societal level malice/bad things take a decently long time to correct itself.

               So dont wait until then, life is too short to wait for the government to come save you. Save yourself ! atleast thats what I did.

               Folks can downvote me all the want, doesnt change , that personal responsibility is the only reliable way in this world to consistently lead a happier life.

               1. autoexec · 1790657333 · focus · HN ↗

                  > personal responsibility is the only reliable way in this world to consistently lead a happier life.

                  If there's a fight between you and a multinational corporation with hundreds of thousands of employees and trillions of dollars, and they're willing to devote more money that you'll ever see in your life towards manipulating you, lying to you, addicting you, removing alternatives, and making it harder for you to resist them, do you seriously think you're going to hold out? And even if you manage to do it, how long can you keep that up?

                  We do need people to try to act responsibly, but we need corporations to act responsibly as well. Regulations make that possible. Until we get them, sure, resist all you can, while you can, but you will slip up or be worn down eventually. If not in one area of your life, then in another and another. You can't stay hypervigilant 100% of the time, and the stress of being hypervigilant will hurt you.

                  As long as companies can continue to assault your well-being for their profits unchecked you're fighting a battle you can't win. Even if you manage to resist, not everyone can.

         2. specialist · 1790652526 · focus · HN ↗

            I prefer the notion of shared responsibility.
         3. cortesoft · 1790656843 · focus · HN ↗

            Personal responsibility is what you focus on when you are talking to an individual. If you are trying to make your life better, or someone you know's life better, it is great to talk about personal responsibility and making choices for your life.

            But that doesn't apply when we are talking about society wide shifts in behavior. It isn't like people suddenly got genetically better or worse at taking personal responsibility. If suddenly a lot fewer people are making healthy decisions, that isn't because we just happened to birth a bunch of people who don't take personal responsibility. Something has changed. Individuals have a lot of control over their own lives, but at a society level all of those individual decisions average out, and you are left with a representation of the effect of society.

            Systemic problems require systemic solutions.

            1. wredcoll · 1790659093 · focus · HN ↗

               Man, this was a really good response to that type of argument. I'm going to save it for later.
            2. sellmesoap · 1790717553 · focus · HN ↗

               Yes people can get swept up in things and be unaware of downstream consequences of their actions, but you can also become informed and decide to change your behavior, find ways to mitigate damage, or communicate with others the damage/solution. How easy to wave your hand at the government or a corporate entity and abdicate responsibility, the parent is correct; personal accountability is faster and more effective than government regulations that also have knock on effects. My regulation example would be how cars in north america became less popular when fuel economy regulations were applied to them, but not SUVs creating the monster car epidemic we all live in.
         4. johnnyanmac · 1790657509 · focus · HN ↗

            [delayed]
      2. popularonion · 1790651444 · focus · HN ↗

         US politicians have been at war against teenage drinking since the 1980s when the minimum drinking age was raised. Gen Z social trends helped it along, but this is the desired outcome of bipartisan policy going back decades.

         1. californical · 1790653761 · focus · HN ↗

            More than half of Gen Z is over the legal drinking age now, I’m not sure teen drinking is it

            1. NewJazz · 1790655239 · focus · HN ↗

               But lower teen drinking can lead to lower lifelong drinking. Habits formed during those years have inertia.
            2. TeMPOraL · 1790662839 · focus · HN ↗

               With US legal drinking age being 21, this eats into drinking at university/drinking after work, which is very much where bulk of socializing for young adults happens. Can't imagine it's not hugely affecting adulthood habits.

               1. kortilla · 1790666568 · focus · HN ↗

                  Eh, 21 limit was in place for all millennials and most of Gen X. And millennials drink like fish.
         2. seizethecheese · 1790654517 · focus · HN ↗

            [delayed]
         3. johnnyanmac · 1790657050 · focus · HN ↗

            All thanks to crashing the economy and making the act of spending $15 on a low quality beer untenable for young adults giving 60+% of their income to rent.

            Alcohol tax would have been a simpler and much less destructive means of achieving such a goal, but I guess breweries can't lobby when everything else is collapsing too.

            1. FlowingRiver · 1790657931 · focus · HN ↗

               When they introduced the higher alcohol tax here in Australia back in 2006(ish), all it did was push us to find ways to make it ourselves. Went from cheap to unbelievably cheap but completely unregulated. Who knows what the alcohol content of some of that stuff was. There are some vague fuzzy nights from that period.
            2. jeltz · 1790671706 · focus · HN ↗

               You see the same trend in countries without a crashing economy. The economy is not the main reason.

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