Thread

1. juiceland · 1790528872 · focus · HN ↗

   Why does China not have this problem?

   1. no-name-here · 1790529085 · focus · HN ↗

      Are Chinese models actually also doing unexpected things, hacking (intentionally or unintentionally), etc but there is just zero transparency provided when it happens?

      To use an analogy to another industry, if you had US food companies providing reports whenever their food had issues, even if it was just during testing or training phases… and then also had a bunch of Chinese companies but who never reported having any food issues…

      1. [deleted] · 1790529282 · focus · HN ↗

         [deleted]

      2. username_my1 · 1790529344 · focus · HN ↗

         the target companies are the ones reporting the hacks in many cases.
      3. freehorse · 1790529505 · focus · HN ↗

         > there is just zero transparency provided when it happens?

         Neither does openai, as there keep coming third-party reports of incidents that have happened there that openai either did not know or basically concealed.

         1. no-name-here · 1790565163 · focus · HN ↗

            That is surprising to hear, as one of the primary claims I frequently hear is that the US labs intentionally causing these incidents (or even making it up) in order to claim that AI can cause harms that have caused other industries to face some kinds of rules.

            >> [With China's AI] there is just zero transparency provided when it happens?

            > Neither does openai…

            What are the examples of 3rd-party reports of "incidents" where OpenAI covered it up, etc? And do you really believe when you said OpenAI provides "zero transparency" when their models do something unexpected, negative, etc?

      4. torginus · 1790529922 · focus · HN ↗

         Generally, the Chinese don't have a good track record of supressing information.

         As in they do the 'we have deleted tons of videos and posts about the thing that didn't happen last week', but it seems they haven't really managed to transcribe 'Streisand' into Han characters so far.

         1. no-name-here · 1790565971 · focus · HN ↗

            Haven't they just indefinitely "disappeared" even famous technology leaders, famous billionaires, famous celebrities, famous athletes, etc. if they say something the government doesn't approve of? As a BBC headline put it "Why do Chinese billionaires keep vanishing?" After one famous athlete said something the government did not approve of, that same day her name got blocked from even being searched for, her posts and accounts were taken down, and she was disappeared. Heck, even names of people or modern incidents that China doesn't want mentioned get proactively blocked from end users discussing them. And there's a lot more too. Are companies really willing to be honest in that kind of environment?

            I guess your point is that at least those outside China will at least hear when they “disappear” someone especially famous, but my argument is that almost no one is going to be willing to speak out, especially for a cause like whether their AI hacked someone?

            1. torginus · 1790576869 · focus · HN ↗

               They probably did, but this is the exact wrong reaction. Trust me, they're famous in China too.

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