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How we learned to stop worrying and love campus surveillance

269 points · 139 comments · cdrnsf

  1. collyw · · focus · HN ↗
    Has any of this surveillance bullshit reduced the number of incidents that occurred where they have been installed? I find it terrifying.
    1. augment_me · · focus · HN ↗
      No because its not the purpose. The purpose is to reduce risk by having accountability assignment to things like demonstrations that hurts the funding of the institution.

      There was a bunch of anti-Israel stuff for example, which goes against the alignment of the university donors. In order to be able to assign accountability and prevent reoccurrence of such events, its useful to know who did these things so you can take necessary measures.

      A bunch of cameras cost much much less than what stopped funding would cost the university, so it's the rational choice.

      1. rembal · · focus · HN ↗
        If the goal of the university is to be a fund vacuum cleaner it's rational. If the goal is to output free thinking, open minded graduates...
        1. melbournesky · · focus · HN ↗
          free thinking, open minded graduates are great as long as they don't question or criticize israel
          1. john-h-k · · focus · HN ↗

            [dead]

            1. melbournesky · · focus · HN ↗

              [dead]

        2. augment_me · · focus · HN ↗
          I don't think the board of a 5.3 billion dollar(2025) revenue machine with a 8-9% yearly profit margin care about the latter things to the same extent as the former.
          1. georgeecollins · · focus · HN ↗
            Maybe what has happened is Universities have become too rich and economically important to be places of free speech and independent thought. If so, some other institution will have to take on that role.
            1. augment_me · · focus · HN ↗
              What's the monetary incentive to fund such institutions? Or how is such an institution going to survive, pay its teachers, etc?
            2. tancop · · focus · HN ↗
              What happened is boards and MBAs. There would be a lot less of this if all universities had a democratic assembly that can replace the director any time and overrule their decisions. Schools belong to students and teachers not business people. Management should serve them not the other way around.
      2. lostlogin · · focus · HN ↗
        > it's the rational choice.

        Time will tell. Long term, I think it’ll hurt them.

        1. augment_me · · focus · HN ↗
          I really doubt that putting up some cameras will make the institution suffer monetarily in the long term, especially considering that newer generations are essentially brought up and normalized to full mass surveillance already.
        2. deaux · · focus · HN ↗
          Of course it won't. It never has. The people making these decisions and profiting from them will be long gone, even if it ends up hurting the university (which it won't)
        3. Waterluvian · · focus · HN ↗
          I’m still waiting for my ancestor’s liege lord to realize that posting a guard outside our town’s tavern was going to backfire long term.

          Security, but at what cost?!

      3. kakadu · · focus · HN ↗
        > which goes against the alignment of the university donors

        Why do we allow non public universities to exist again?

        1. dgellow · · focus · HN ↗
          Have you seen the current US administration? The country isn’t even remotely close to have that discussion, you’re lucky the failed insurrectionist, rapist hasn’t yet made public universities illegal via an executive order (yes that would be absurd, they don’t care)
      4. hiddencost · · focus · HN ↗
        Those protests were anti Genocide and anti land theft, calling them anti Israel is misleading.
        1. [deleted] · · focus · HN ↗

          [deleted]

    2. Our_Benefactors · · focus · HN ↗
      Yes, flock cameras basically solved the problem with San Fran car breakins.
      1. samudrijan · · focus · HN ↗
        No one from the city calls it San Fran.
        1. musicale · · focus · HN ↗
          Wikipedia claims it's used by "non-native residents" - who, it might be argued, are "from" the city since they happen to live there.

          <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Nicknames_of_San_Francisco" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;en.wikipedia.org&#x2F;wiki&#x2F;Nicknames_of_San_Francisco

        2. Our_Benefactors · · focus · HN ↗
          You don’t have to be from the city to read a crime chart. What kind of absurd gatekeeping is this?
          1. defrost · · focus · HN ↗
            You do have to put some effort into understanding crime and prosecution figures though.

            Was it actually flock that saw the cratering of car breakins in 2024 - or was it the increase in successful prosecutions following the passing of SB 905 which closed the &quot;locked door loophole&quot; ?

      2. asdff · · focus · HN ↗
        How would a camera stop a break in? All that does it catch it on camera. So many celebrities and rich people all have top of the line security systems connected to rapid response patrols already stationed in the neighborhood to get there faster than police. They still get robbed, and they get to watch a video after of people dressed in all black rifle through their possessions and get out in 3 minutes driving away in a stolen car.

        Some SF specific clearance rate data:

        <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.sanfranciscopolice.org&#x2F;stay-safe&#x2F;crime-data&#x2F;clearance-rates-dashboard" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;www.sanfranciscopolice.org&#x2F;stay-safe&#x2F;crime-data&#x2F;clea...

        They only solved 9% of car thefts this year with all this flock surveillance. Little different from last year.

      3. collyw · · focus · HN ↗
        So one of the places where they won&#x27;t actually be monitoring people (most of the time).
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