Thread

1. Shank · 1790247119 · focus · HN ↗

   It feels like it’s very, very risky territory for these activities to be “occurring” in a NATO country. I’m sure everyone else is thinking the same thing, but at what point does Article 5 get invoked?

   1. Kinrany · 1790247495 · focus · HN ↗

      Undermining article 5 is the goal, so NATO needs to figure out how to invoke it gradually.

      One thought is to pretend to not know that it's Russia, and invoke it against an "unidentified adversary".

      1. petcat · 1790249634 · focus · HN ↗

         Nobody actually wants to invoke Article 5. The European countries talk a lot, but they don't actually want to do anything serious.

         Macron famously said that he would "have to send troops to Odesa" and yet 3 years later there are still no French troops in Ukraine and Russia has captured even more territory and is now actively bombarding Kyiv.

         The reality is that, despite their public statements and posture, every leader in the EU secretly hopes USA can broker a peace deal and this all just kinda goes away.

         1. munksbeer · 1790271423 · focus · HN ↗

            You're saying this as if it is some kind of gotcha? Don't you hope, not so secretly, that a peace deal can be brokered and we don't have to send our young men to war? I know I do, and I hope most people do. It would be weird if you don't.

            The reality is, despite Trump being a gigantic arsehole, the US is still, by a huge margin, the worlds premier military. Realistically, they have the best chance of exerting pressure for a peace deal. I just wish Trump would live up to his promises for once.

            1. donkey_brains · 1790309081 · focus · HN ↗

               And I wish I was flying though the night sky on a magical talking pony but here we are

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