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Show HN: I built a new version of my fun spatial 3D online meeting app

98 points · 52 comments · pawelwentpawel

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zacharycohn · 1789650783 · focus · HN ↗
This is super neat.
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789650808 · focus · HN ↗
  Thank you!
findthebug · 1789651162 · focus · HN ↗
i call this the end game of social media
mtford · 1789651199 · focus · HN ↗
Very impressive, well done!
dangond · 1789651307 · focus · HN ↗
As someone who has seen and used (and disliked) many similar pieces of software, something about this feels much better and natural (I think it's that your avatar is just a circle with your video on it). Great job on nailing the feel of it!
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789651478 · focus · HN ↗
  Thank you! Getting the vibe right was definitely a challenging part, especially light and colours
hnicrcjk6o · 1789651629 · focus · HN ↗
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jackb4040 · 1789652056 · focus · HN ↗
Those videos of the actual webcam feeds are AI-generated, right? If I were you I would at least use the videos of real people from the original demo, if not try to have another live demo. Maybe not the highest priority but it does affect the first impression of the product and whether people assume it's a vibecoded mess under the hood or not.
Anyways, is source available anywhere?
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789652626 · focus · HN ↗
  Yep, the faces in the demo video are AI right now, mostly for speed. I built a little system to direct / record it but real faces coming soon too!
  1. gus_massa · 1789653226 · focus · HN ↗
    Real faces as in your friends or actors, or real faces as in unsuspecting users? (I guess the first.)
    pawelwentpawel · 1789653783 · focus · HN ↗
    Just friends!
  2. jackb4040 · 1789653693 · focus · HN ↗
    Haha cool I figured that's all it was.
  3. raphman · 1789657794 · focus · HN ↗
    mildly interesting detail: some of the videos also include an audio track - and because some of the videos are mirrored in time, you get to hear demonic voices:
    <a href="https://flat-social-bucket.lon1.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/personas-web/ada/talking.mp4" rel="nofollow">https://flat-social-bucket.lon1.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/p...
    <a href="https://flat-social-bucket.lon1.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/personas-web/maya/talking.mp4" rel="nofollow">https://flat-social-bucket.lon1.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/p...
    (and I really like this audio-less one: <a href="https://flat-social-bucket.lon1.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/personas-web/mike/mike-conference.mp4" rel="nofollow">https://flat-social-bucket.lon1.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/p...)
2. toader · 1789653214 · focus · HN ↗
  Are developers still in denial about the capabilities of coding agents, "vibecoded mess under the hood or not"? If the application works, do you think most users are thinking about the code quality?
  1. jackb4040 · 1789653526 · focus · HN ↗
    OP actually just answered my question with no problem, we're all good bro. We don't need pro-AI evangelists inserting themselves.
    toader · 1789653666 · focus · HN ↗
    Not being in denial about the capabilities of coding agents is a far cry from being an "pro-AI evangelists"... 'bro'.
micromacrofoot · 1789652116 · focus · HN ↗
I would work on affordances for when people with 0 gaming experience need to join, maybe a flat or simplified mode that someone can opt in to.
I have a lot of experience testing a defunct spatial conferencing app during the pandemic and gamers had fun with it but people with no gaming experience universally hated it.
prometheus1992 · 1789652189 · focus · HN ↗
Okay, you got me on the first impressions. signed up. also, use a demo video which has real people doing those activities and smiling etc. A little bit of authenticity will go a long way here.
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789652489 · focus · HN ↗
  Thanks! Yep totally agree on the demo faces, they were mostly AI now for the speed but more videos with humans coming soon.
KolmogorovComp · 1789653020 · focus · HN ↗
this is unbearably slow and unusable on Safari.
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789653922 · focus · HN ↗
  Thanks for the feedback! Initial couple seconds when the map is loading are indeed slow, I'll be optimising this as my priority in the next days.
topper00_raptor · 1789653078 · focus · HN ↗
Really fun, reminds me of thia pp my company use to use during Covid <a href="https://workadventu.re/" rel="nofollow">https://workadventu.re/
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789653701 · focus · HN ↗
  Thank you! Yep there was a bunch of those, a lot of them with a pixel style aesthetic.
kittikitti · 1789653097 · focus · HN ↗
This is really great and I hope it succeeds. I am waiting for a service that combines the virtual spaces concepts of Habbo Hotel into digital meeting spaces. I think Meta VR attempted this but it was too clunky (requires a headset). Mozilla Hubs attempted this too but it was too similar to Second Life and Roblox in the sense that things were not modular enough and it takes too long to do simple things.
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789655185 · focus · HN ↗
  Thank you! There might not be as many elements in flat.social as there are in Habbo Hotel but I built an entire map builder which you can use to customise your space. There is a bunch of options - from procedural persian rugs to furnite, plants and lamps. You can even add a dill pickles jar that vigorously opens itself when you press enter.
xander_north · 1789653857 · focus · HN ↗
This is amazing!
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789654307 · focus · HN ↗
  Thank you!
Vishal_Max · 1789654507 · focus · HN ↗
This is so cool, i am going to try this with my friends, i will let you know about the experience.
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789654576 · focus · HN ↗
  Thank you! There is also a little support / feedback button on the bottom left. Whenever you have any comments, feel free to use it.
coldblues · 1789654653 · focus · HN ↗
Performance is poor with frequent stutters.
I think we peaked at <a href="https://www.gather.town/" rel="nofollow">https://www.gather.town/
The only on-par open source solution is <a href="https://workadventu.re/" rel="nofollow">https://workadventu.re/, but it is impossible to self-host to the point that one would think they're doing it on purpose so that you pay them for hosting.
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789654838 · focus · HN ↗
  Hey, thanks for the feedback! It might be the first map load that's a bit heavy (I'm working on this now) - later once everything is loaded it should be much faster. Was it just the first couple seconds that were problematic for you or you stayed longer?
  PS. there is also a bunch of graphic tiers which suit more older machines. If you click on the top right there is a menu which has a graphics tab. It should switch automatically after a while too.
2. serf · 1789658271 · focus · HN ↗
  >The only on-par open source solution is <a href="https://workadventu.re/" rel="nofollow">https://workadventu.re/, but it is impossible to self-host to the point that one would think they're doing it on purpose so that you pay them for hosting.
  is there a name for this? I've seen it all over recently. Ente products are like that; it's self-hostable but you've gotta really want it.
  One trademark of this : the first steps of install are easy, but then it progresses into this quagmire of no-docs/old-docs/presets that favor the company somehow.
  one of these things, (maybe ente photos/auth?) were self-hostable but there was a secret button on the app that had to be known about to input a server URI outside of the cloud host. Why would you go to that extent if not to add friction?
  1. pwython · 1789671402 · focus · HN ↗
    > is there a name for this?
    <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open-core_model" rel="nofollow">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open-core_model
suopspaces · 1789655720 · focus · HN ↗
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hmokiguess · 1789656019 · focus · HN ↗
I don't know man, I think I am not the right audience for this. I think online meetings are fine as is, I want to spend less time on them and more time connecting in real life.
I have been working remotely for a decade now, with fully remote teams, and we never felt the need for a deeper bonding in the form of work meetings that are more casual.
That said, if we want this kind of experience, online gaming already gives us that. I see lots of members of the team hanging out by discord and in gaming platforms.
Looks cool, but I don't want it. That's just my opinion.
1. yawz · 1789658062 · focus · HN ↗
  I always wonder who the right audience is for this type of virtual environment for online meetings. And I am seriously curious because I am probably too old to relate to younger professionals these days, so I may be missing something that other may find fun.
  1. hmokiguess · 1789658586 · focus · HN ↗
    Well, in my case I am more than glad to be missing on this fun is my point.
    I think I wouldn't be able to function well in a work environment that had this kind of setup for their meetings on a regular basis, it would feel very draining to me.
    I would be certainly open to it infrequently, or as an opt-in, but if the workplace moves towards this direction I know I would struggle.
2. Stevvo · 1789660571 · focus · HN ↗
  HRTF spatialized audio should make your meetings shorter through more efficient communication. It's not about "bonding". For example in a traditional online meeting, it's very difficult to interrupt/interject but than can be done naturally with good spatial audio.
  1. hmokiguess · 1789664037 · focus · HN ↗
    Most meeting software nowadays has a “queue” system which lets you put your hand up. I think that has been a perfect solution to me. In large calls you also have moderators and mute controls.
3. lopis · 1789661168 · focus · HN ↗
  We tried a "fun" virtual office tool around covid times called Gather Town, which is 2D. People liked the virtual office, but only for certain company events like hackathons or meetups. The general audience totally prefers something like slack for texting and meeting.
  We also had an issue with a few people getting motion sickness from any 3D games, so any 3D virtual meeting space was out of the question for our company. A flat 2D UI would be preferable to the "low performance" option that this project provides, which is quite jarring.
  1. pawelwentpawel · 1789661460 · focus · HN ↗
    The motion sickness part is interesting, never thought about that. In flat.social, you get a 3D view but it's isometric by default, not a first-person view experience.
    lopis · 1789662342 · focus · HN ↗
    The first person ones were definitely more motion sickness inducing, but 3rd person view also apparently causes it. There was one person for whom even the 2D game caused some sickness when panning the camera around. I was very surprised.
4. sockpuppers · 1789662508 · focus · HN ↗
  Is it appealing to people who like open plan offices?
  We had to use Gather during covid, as a constant presence virtual office, all day long. It was an exhausting stream of endless distractions, the spatial audio meant people would just start randomly talking to you. But unless you had it pulled up on a monitor dedicated only to it, the real experience was a background tab of disembodied voices playing through your speakers at random, it was jarring and inhumane.
5. lateatdesk · 1789666210 · focus · HN ↗
  But what if half the group just wants to chat? I can see this working with a few people kicking a ball around while everyone else talks :)
fittingopposite · 1789656211 · focus · HN ↗
> I had a couple of months off this year, so I locked myself in an (almost) jungle house in Brazil
Tell us more about this experience. Very interesting!
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789656403 · focus · HN ↗
  Pure silence, strong internet, great food and monkeys to feed in the garden every morning. One of the best work environments I had in years :)
harvey9 · 1789656442 · focus · HN ↗
Having a birds eye view changes the dynamic of an in person event because you can more easily observe who makes a beeline for who. But as someone who gets a headache from first person games I still prefer birds eye anyway.
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789656638 · focus · HN ↗
  Thanks for feedback! You can actually select between a couple views - isometric, view from the top and first-person view.
raphman · 1789656919 · focus · HN ↗
Sounds interesting - especially as gather.town no longer offers an event option. However, the landing page uses 100% CPU and stutters a lot. Also, signup does not work for me, with <a href="https://app.flat.social/api/auth/signup" rel="nofollow">https://app.flat.social/api/auth/signup returning 403 forbidden:
```
  {&quot;success&quot;:false,&quot;error&quot;:&quot;Verification failed, please try again&quot;}
```
(No captcha was shown on the page.)
monoRepo11 · 1789657991 · focus · HN ↗
This looks cool! I think I would use it more as an online platform for friends rather than work or business. Maybe lean more into the social / games aspects
ricksunny · 1789658250 · focus · HN ↗
The UX sits in an interesting hybrid place between Gather App and Katmai - would be fun to try out with collaborators sometime
folder · 1789659057 · focus · HN ↗
Really lovely concept. I think your welcome map is too complex seems like that should be simplified for a good first experience for more devices.
1. pawelwentpawel · 1789660438 · focus · HN ↗
  Thank you! There is a button to switch the type of view on the bottom left (isometric, top view, first person) which could help out here.
  To release the balloons you need to press space and you will fall back down on the ground.
homeonthemtn · 1789661522 · focus · HN ↗
It's a cute social app. The moment it becomes forced "bonding" with your coworkers is the moment it gets weird and dystopian
Also the moment it gets a public room, you're getting a dick and balls chasing that soccer ball
Just saying
tamimio · 1789669177 · focus · HN ↗
It’s probably better to make and join roblox server, it looks cool nonetheless, that being said, that might make people do more meetings which is not really a good thing in general.
rkowal · 1789673984 · focus · HN ↗
feels natural - seen many such projects during covid
HerrlichDigital · 1790066770 · focus · HN ↗
Really nice Project, I'm working with WebRTC my self and i struggled with different things that cause the problems mentioned in the comments. For example Safari has some weird WebRTC quirks (getUserMedia/codec differences vs. Chrome) further more the stutters are often scaling problems and not because of the rendering. And i have seen in my analytics for my App <a href="https://sharry.live" rel="nofollow">https://sharry.live that there are often connection problems because of restrictive network settings which can be handled by a TURN Server.
vancekai · 1790132656 · focus · HN ↗
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