Thread

1. whatever1 · 1790685721 · focus · HN ↗

   Man we technologists are so bad at dealing with societal issues.

   We try to reinvent something that claims that keeps tabs on everyone and for sure will punish you if you don’t behave well but will reward you if do!

   The thing has a name. It’s the religion.

   1. ozyschmozy · 1790686058 · focus · HN ↗

      This is a take I hadn't heard before, pretty interesting. I wonder if there are already any fiction out there where some widespread religion turns out to be an automated mass surveillance and policing system gone awry. Neat concept

      1. brink · 1790686293 · focus · HN ↗

         Humans are inherently religious, whether you see it or not. We all worship something.

         1. antonvs · 1790687711 · focus · HN ↗

            No, words have meaning and "worship" is not something that everyone does. This isn't an AA meeting where "everyone has a higher power."

            You're probably just parroting David Foster Wallace.

            1. [deleted] · 1790688605 · focus · HN ↗

               [deleted]

            2. thin_carapace · 1790734329 · focus · HN ↗

               the defensiveness makes it seem you have an ardent love for words, almost as though you worship their meaning
      2. Tarq0n · 1790688626 · focus · HN ↗

         > "The need to be observed and understood was once satisfied by God. Now we can implement the same functionality with data-mining algorithms."

         > "God and the gods were apparitions of observation, judgment and punishment. Other sentiments towards them were secondary."

         > "The human organism always worships. First it was the gods, then it was fame (the observation and judgment of others), next it will be the self-aware systems you have built to realize truly omnipresent observation and judgment."

         > "The individual desires judgment. Without that desire, the cohesion of groups is impossible, and so is civilization."

         > "The human being created civilization not because of a willingness but because of a need to be assimilated into higher orders of structure and meaning."

         > "God was a dream of good government."

         > "You will soon have your God, and you will make it with your own hands."

         - Morpheus ( Deus Ex, 2000)

   2. graemep · 1790689616 · focus · HN ↗

      That is true of some religions - e.g. moralistic therapeutic deism. It is sort of true of Buddhism because of belief in karma, but that is an automatic mechanism rather than a punishment.

      It is not true of Christianity, which promises forgiveness, nor of the other Abrahamic religions.

      1. whatever1 · 1790690855 · focus · HN ↗

         Not a theologist, but pretty sure that the default destination for the bad Christians is hell.

         There is an out-of-hell card you can get if you pay your dues to the local enforcement branch (before you die, they need today’s money not after life checks)

         1. graemep · 1790692631 · focus · HN ↗

            > Not a theologist, but pretty sure that the default destination for the bad Christians is hell.

            Absolutely not.

            > There is an out-of-hell card you can get if you pay your dues to the local enforcement branch (before you die, they need today’s money not after life checks)

            Where did you get that from?

            I am assuming you are just badly informed but that is really stretching the assumption of good faith.

            The Catholic church believes hell is self chosen:

            > To die in mortal sin without repenting and accepting God's merciful love means remaining separated from him for ever by our own free choice. This state of definitive self-exclusion from communion with God and the blessed is called "hell."

            <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;ccc.cab&#x2F;1033" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;ccc.cab&#x2F;1033

            Traditional protestants often believe the same, but there is variety. Some believe all human beings are redeemed, for example.

            Some evangelicals do believe in hell for non-believers, but most of those also believe faith is the key to redemption, so you are safe if you are a Christian.

   3. zug_zug · 1790690369 · focus · HN ↗

      Yeah following on this, when you look at places that actually are low-crime it&#x27;s almost always cultural. But if all you have is a hammer everything looks like a nail I guess.

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