Thread

1. alexandre_m · 1790644533 · focus · HN ↗

   > while young people are drinking less alcohol due to health and financial concerns

   My observation is that gen-z spends less time socializing in real life, and drinking remains a social habit for the most part at a younger age. While they drink less, cannabis, vaping and psychedelics are on the rise.

   It's a nice claim to say they are more responsible, but it tells an incomplete story.

   1. fzeindl · 1790658996 · focus · HN ↗

      > My observation is that gen-z spends less time socializing in real life…

      A barkeeper from a prestigious, world class cocktail bar around the corner told me that it really is more about health/alcohol.

      He had a group the other day of 20 young people and 18 of them ordered non-alcoholic drinks. He is desperate about his profession.

      1. refactor_master · 1790660218 · focus · HN ↗

         My take is that people “these days” just don’t want to put in the time, money or effort in socializing, especially with new groups of people. Be it dating, meetups or other social gatherings with strangers, it’s about giving as little as you can, in case the event turns out to be a dud. Why risk paying for 2 beers when you could buy one tea for less?

         Now, how can I be so sure? Because I’ve been starving at some of these events, whereas others can seemingly call a single slice of pizza dinner.

         There’s most definitely a health aspect in there too, but I don’t think it paints the whole story.

         1. dmantis · 1790670348 · focus · HN ↗

            I dunno. I don't drink, but I do put time and effort to socialize.

            It's just not related to drug consuming acts and more about sports, poker, board games, etc.

            I believe that drug-related communications are flawed and closer to animal level than to actually joyful ones. It's better to have a maturity and social skills to communicate, joke and maintain a conversation with interesting people without stimulators.

            I'm not from the US though so it's not about the US social scene which is mainly discussed here.

            1. anal_reactor · 1790680133 · focus · HN ↗

               > closer to animal level than to actually joyful ones

               That's exactly the point. To experience animalistic joy, rather than the socially-conditioned one.

               > It's better to have a maturity and social skills

               That's a very silly argument because it doesn't take into account the fact that a day has 24 hours and also people have different natural abilities. Imagine telling a kid with Down Syndrome "come on, you can do it, PhD in physics ain't that difficult".

               1. dmantis · 1790681088 · focus · HN ↗

                  > That's a very silly argument

                  I disagree.

                  Communication is a skill like everything else. Having a constant workaround just reduces your ability to be good at it. Why would a healthy young adult make his own skills worse?

                  You can either get short-term gains with long-term worsening of your daily life by being incapable of new connections and genuine communications or cut the short-term low-level improvements, suffer for a year or two, learn a bit and have a better life for years to come.

                  It's like going to gym or do other sports. It's often hard and unpleasant at the start, but the more you're doing it, the fitter you are and the more benefits you bring to yourself in the long-term.

                  1. anal_reactor · 1790688339 · focus · HN ↗

                     You don't understand my core premise that given finite lifespan and finite attention, one can learn only a finite amount of things. People have shit to do and they cannot fit one more responsibility into their calendars. Not to mention that it takes two to tango so if you want to be fun and interesting while sober, you also need to convince your friends to also be sober so it's not all awkward.

                     It's really difficult to square the circle that being sober improves your communication skills long-term yet somehow young people have worse communication skills and less friends that previous generations of alcohlics.

                     1. dmantis · 1790688812 · focus · HN ↗

                        > somehow young people have worse communication skills and less friends

                        I have a feeling that many young people sit behind the screen all the time.

                        My argument doesn't work if you don't even try to socialize.

                        1. anal_reactor · 1790691401 · focus · HN ↗

                           > My point doesn't work if you don't even try to socialize.

                           Yeah exactly. Alcohol makes it easier to start and then continue.

      2. Xirdus · 1790660599 · focus · HN ↗

         I and virtually everyone in my generation have been constantly lectured throughout almost entire education about the dangers of smoking and drinking. As a result, while we smoke and drink heavily, it's not even close to our parents. So it makes perfect sense that the next generation, who were not only lectured their whole life but also didn't grow up surrounded by people smoking everywhere and drinking all the time, overwhelmingly avoided picking up these habits at all.
      3. CTDOCodebases · 1790661673 · focus · HN ↗

         I would agree with his opinion. You can see it with the increase of non-alcoholic wine and beer.
      4. sneak · 1790661998 · focus · HN ↗

         Alcohol is one of the worst recreational drugs. Internet natives grew up with more access to information and less draconian drug laws than their predecessors.

         In the 90s, MDMA got senators’ panties in a twist. Now, there are multiple 100k+ MDMA-focused events in the western USA annually.

      5. whiteblossom · 1790663815 · focus · HN ↗

         I could see it being a mix of both factors. Cash-strapped antisocial members staying at home, and the more outgoing career-focused gen-z members going out but trying to protect their sleep quality. feel like i know a decent amount of people in both of these buckets
      6. Majikujanisch · 1790666214 · focus · HN ↗

         I mean, i am about to marry in about 2 months and have no one to invite as i never was able to socialize with anyone outside of school (and since then 5 years passed) and if they mostly have a unhealty relation to alcohol so i don't want to do something with them. I have like 1-2 friends that i can smoke with and also only know them because of that, we game in out free time and only meet to hand over some herbs. I would love to go out and meet new peers but i cannot without drinking and after spending like 60-70% on rent there is not enough to spend 6-8€ on a WATER.

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