Thread

EV Sales Are Booming in Europe with Gasoline at $10 a Gallon

79 points · 150 comments · blondie9x

gambiting · 1790547426 · focus · HN ↗
I mean, I feel like even if petrol wasn't as expensive as it is, the sales would be booming anyway, maybe a sliver slower - for the simple reason that affordable EVs are now here and they are pretty damn good now. After years and years of lamenting "where are the EVs for your average Joe Smith" - they are now here. Funnily enough, they aren't made by Volkswagen or Peugeot, but they are here anyway. And Europe's cheapest new car - Dacia Spring - is an EV.
1. diath · 1790550341 · focus · HN ↗
  You're delusional if you think an EV is affordable for an average person. The average person barely makes enough to cover rent, food, bills and save a little money - 15-30k EUR for an entry level EV is out of question. Meanwhile most people can afford to get a late 90s/early 00s used car that will actually get the job done.
  1. stoneman24 · 1790550979 · focus · HN ↗
    In the uk, there can be good deals on used EVs. My Hyundai Kona EV (64kWh) (2022 plate) was £18K for a 18 month old car with 9K miles on the clock and lots of options. It does about 280 miles on a charge and I do have the advantage of cheap home charging (8p per kWh) so it’s under a £5 for my weekly commute.
    A big step up from my old Ford fiesta, just look for the deals
    [deleted] · 1790551361 · focus · HN ↗
    [deleted]
    diath · 1790551782 · focus · HN ↗
    According to this data an average Brit would be able to save about 600 GBP monthly if they never had any extra expenses outside of rent and living costs. I don't think even a "good deal" 18k vehicle is affordable for that person.
    <a href="https://movingtotheuk.co.uk/cost-of-living-in-the-uk/average-salary-uk" rel="nofollow">https://movingtotheuk.co.uk/cost-of-living-in-the-uk/average...
    <a href="https://movingtotheuk.co.uk/cost-of-living-in-the-uk" rel="nofollow">https://movingtotheuk.co.uk/cost-of-living-in-the-uk
    <a href="https://www.livingcost.net/united-kingdom" rel="nofollow">https://www.livingcost.net/united-kingdom
    happymellon · 1790580935 · focus · HN ↗
    What are you talking about?
    If they are driving then they are currently potentially spending a couple of hundred pounds a month on fuel for a subcompact car. We are breaching the monthly cost of a car loan to move to electric purely in the cost of petrol.
    rightnutwingjob · 1790553006 · focus · HN ↗
    >> 15-30k EUR for an entry level EV is out of question
    > My Hyundai Kona EV (64kWh) (2022 plate) was £18K
    Completely fkn tone deaf.
    jandrewrogers · 1790554550 · focus · HN ↗
    £18k is something like 60% of the median income in the UK after taxes. And that doesn’t even include the other associated costs. Average people would view that as a major expense.
    Many people don’t have the elasticity in their month-to-month expenses that is assumed here.
    happymellon · 1790580782 · focus · HN ↗
    Its bizarre the hate your getting for this comment.
    You can get a used Hyundai Kona EV from Hyundai for under £15k.
    <a href="https://used.hyundai.co.uk/en/used-car-search/hyundai/kona/kona-electric-suv-e-150kw-premium-se-jjddg3n" rel="nofollow">https://used.hyundai.co.uk/en/used-car-search/hyundai/kona/k...
    Even going off your £18k price, a car loan search shows it would be under £200 per month. Not sure where they pulled £600 from.
    But filling up my wife's compact Peugeot 208 (I think?) was £75 over the weekend. Filling up twice is almost the same monthly cost as buying a larger electric SUV.
    It definitely seems like it would be worth investigating your options.
    stoneman24 · 1790581751 · focus · HN ↗
    It did seem odd, I usually buy used cars around 10K and 18 months old. But after getting friends and recommendations for EVs and a decent trade in to offset the 18K a little and some savings and finance, I went for the Kona. Won’t go back.
    I used to have a diesel Renault Clio, thankfully I don’t have it anymore at the current £2 per litre for diesel.
    On the commute into Edinburgh today, there’s plenty of newer cars than mine and quite a few EVs, so some people are buying them.
  2. SupremumLimit · 1790551145 · focus · HN ↗
    Average fleet age in EU looks to be around 13 years so when you say "most people", you're likely off by 10-15 years in terms of second hand purchases. Greece might be the only EU country that gets close to what you said. I get the point about affordability but it's good to base discussion on facts.
    Also, EVs have been around for quite a few years now so it is no longer necessary to buy them new.
    <a href="https://www.acea.auto/publication/report-vehicles-on-european-roads-2025/" rel="nofollow">https://www.acea.auto/publication/report-vehicles-on-europea...
    rightnutwingjob · 1790553208 · focus · HN ↗
    Buying an EV outside of the factory warranty period is not an experiment I’d be interested in participating.
    What do you do when, say, the insulation on the motor’s windings disintegrates over night on a whole production run of thousands of cars.
    Or the batteries turn out to a fail at some yet to be revealed number of charge cycles.
    api · 1790553548 · focus · HN ↗
    These are pretty rare failure modes.
    ICE engines eat themselves in many more different kinds of weird ways: timing chains and belts, coolant leaks, any number of problems with valves and actuators. They're extraordinarily complex devices and it's a testament to engineering genius (and persistence) that we've made them this reliable. But they fail much more often than batteries or motors. They have many more moving parts. It's just the devil we know.
    I've got two EVs. Basically zero problems. I've known one or two people who have had issues, but never with the drive train. Always something dumb like the "infotainment system" or (for a Tesla owning friend) stupid buzzing and vibration they couldn't make go away and stupid problems with door handles.
    The Tesla weirdness is part of why I went with Nissans. They're 100% normal cars except for the electric drive train. All the other parts can be purchased at AutoZone and everything else can be worked on by a normal mechanic.
    There's some mechanics in my area that have been learning how to do stuff with EVs like aftermarket battery upgrades on older models, but it's a bit expensive. Mine are 5 and 13 years old respectively and both batteries are fine. The 5yo one is the same as the day it was bought. The latter's lost some capacity but still very usable as a city car.
    CobaltFire · 1790559837 · focus · HN ↗
    We picked up a used 2022 Leaf S+ a while back and it's been amazing.
    Also just about the only shade tree mechanic EV. Even swapping a battery is doable by the typical car guy. Rebuilding one isn't much harder due to no cooling.
    rightnutwingjob · 1790848674 · focus · HN ↗
    > These are pretty rare failure modes.
    You don’t know that. None of the most recent EV sales are even ten years old yet.
    We don’t know what the common failure modes are.
    bryanlarsen · 1790557184 · focus · HN ↗
    It's not an experiment anymore. Long term data is in, and high mileage EV's are far more reliable than high mileage petrol cars.
    file:///home/blarsen/Downloads/How-durable-are-electric-vehicles-BVRLA-report-by-New-Automotive-September-2026.pdf
    tchalla · 1790560546 · focus · HN ↗
    > file:///home/blarsen/Downloads/How-durable-are-electric-vehicles-BVRLA-report-by-New-Automotive-September-2026.pdf
    Your download folder path is leaking : D
    bryanlarsen · 1790565957 · focus · HN ↗
    Thanks. Too late to edit. If anybody wants the actual link, Google can figure it out from my download path. :) The only PII in the link is also in my username. It also leaked that I'm probably a Linux user.
    dzhiurgis · 1790568827 · focus · HN ↗
    Tesla’s motors are like $200 or 1k for rare ones
    GuestFAUniverse · 1790573377 · focus · HN ↗
    If you worry about such failure modes, you shouldn't drive a car at all. And especially not one with an ICE.
    The main batteries most often have a 8y/160,000km guarantee. (Some even more.) There a enough affordable, used BEVs that are only a quarter through that milages and age.
  3. bryanlarsen · 1790566427 · focus · HN ↗
    At least in Europe people still buy cheap new cars.
    In the US the people who can afford new cars generally want massive SUV's. Meanwhile a lot of the people buying used cars often would prefer a bare bones small vehicle with fewer years and lower miles than something fancier or larger but with more miles. But of course those aren't available since nobody buys those things new. Which leads to the ridiculous outcome that a lightly used Honda Civic is basically the same price as a new one.
  4. gambiting · 1790576677 · focus · HN ↗
    I mean, I'll be honest - I feel like you knew exactly what I meant but then twisted it to make a point you wanted to make.
    Yes, obviously your average person buys a second hand car and new car prices(all of them, not just EVs) are out of reach.
    But the article is about sales(as in - new car sales) - and your average Joe Smith buying a new car is increasingly likely to buy an EV because among other new cars, EVs have actually became affordable.

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