Thread

1. boredatoms · 1790270522 · focus · HN ↗

   The US needs to get over this whole ‘punishment’ view of prison. It either a social-safety quarantine, or a rehabilitation

   1. mrits · 1790270740 · focus · HN ↗

      [dead]

      1. Glemmlko · 1790271477 · focus · HN ↗

         No it shouldn't.

         It should be the understanding of a society that no human being is just 'bad'. A human being became 'bad' by a definiton of a society due to circumstances like upbringing, environment etc. and a society which failed you.

         Prison is the removal of you from society due to impatibility of current values and should help you become 'better'.

         Be happy that you had good/avg parents, the mental strength to help yourself, money, luck, body strength, whatever it was which allowed you to comment on HN instead of being in a prison.

         1. nitwit005 · 1790291237 · focus · HN ↗

            If all it took to ensure a good outcome was to create good circumstances, we'd have fixed society in the prehistoic era. People would have figured it out and asked the good parents to raise all the kids one generation, and problem solved.

            Instead what you see is parents with five successful kids, and one that keeps ending up in prison, and no one can really explain how it went wrong.

            1. jolmg · 1790299821 · focus · HN ↗

               Equal parents doesn't need to mean equal circumstances. Times and culture change, parents age, family circumstances change over time, their environment outside the home is different, different friends, different experiences, etc. There's a myriad of factors that can lead to very different circumstances for siblings.

               1. nitwit005 · 1790303052 · focus · HN ↗

                  If you talk to people working with foster kids about why some kids succeed despite everything stacked against them, they'll tell you some kids are different.

                  It's possible you're correct and there's some circumstance controlling things we can't see or don't understand, but that's not a testable idea.

                  1. jolmg · 1790311321 · focus · HN ↗

                     One can't even say that good circumstances are always better than bad circumstances. Bad circumstances can teach a lot about humility, perseverance, empathy, compassion, etc. Good circumstances can lead to grown, spoiled children, people with a child's concept of how the world works, people with no consideration towards others because they didn't need to be part of a community, etc.

                     Environment plays a huge role, but it's somewhat unpredictable what lessons are taken. One could also say that it's not unanimously clear what makes a good environment; it's likely not simply about having resources and lacking conflict. Likely an amount of scarcity and conflict are needed.

                     All this isn't to say that kids are all born the same, but I don't consider such differences to generally matter as much as the effect the environment can have.

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