There's a continuum between "vibe coded by someone with no technical knowledge or inclination" and "hand written domain driven design development". You can absolutely use coding agents AND have maintainable code. But yes, the coding agents will not magically make everything maintainable if you don't tell them to.
"Code maintainability and good architecture don’t have good measurements that we can apply"
Who has no wisdom? There are dozens of ways to measure code maintainability. Cyclomatic complexity is just one.
Nothing stops you from wiring up something like SonarQube metrics to your agentic coding workflow.
> You can absolutely use coding agents AND have maintainable code. But yes, the coding agents will not magically make everything maintainable if you don't tell them to.
The trillion dollar question is how you do this, if your employees do not care (they are optimising for salary & time spent not code quality) and you have no way of telling apart AI slop vs. good maintainable code. (If you could you would just train the AI.)
Before AI there was at least some way to tell apart good programmers from bad, because there was some human effort involved in coding. Now with AI and slop generation there is almost now way to do this.
> if your employees do not care (they are optimising for salary & time spent not code quality)...
From what I see is it's mainly managers and higher brass who doesn't care about code quality and sustainability, and aims to drive time to market metrics down aggressively with AI.
Any employee who cares about code quality will become a poor performer with a red luddite label because they dare to change what the AI has emitted for them.
I'd love to be wrong, very wrong about this, actually.
They don't care about maintainability because they're not going to be debugging it at 1am on Friday night but mainly because if something is wrong they have lots of people below them to blame for it.
Developers, however, are still responsible for the code! We must review the AI....all 80k lines of code it generated yesterday. If we don't then we are at fault. And we must go full throttle of course. So ....not be picky and retrograde about accepting what is generated.....
IOW we know who is going to get screwed and it isn't them.
Yeah but I mean, what is their compensation based on? I'm genuinely pretty curious about the point you're making here. I don't know anything about underwriting or how that profession works or how it is analogous to what you see as the future for software developers. But it seems interesting and possibly insightful.
davedx · · focus · HN ↗
"Code maintainability and good architecture don’t have good measurements that we can apply"
Who has no wisdom? There are dozens of ways to measure code maintainability. Cyclomatic complexity is just one.
Nothing stops you from wiring up something like SonarQube metrics to your agentic coding workflow.
abroszka33 · · focus · HN ↗
The trillion dollar question is how you do this, if your employees do not care (they are optimising for salary & time spent not code quality) and you have no way of telling apart AI slop vs. good maintainable code. (If you could you would just train the AI.)
Before AI there was at least some way to tell apart good programmers from bad, because there was some human effort involved in coding. Now with AI and slop generation there is almost now way to do this.
bayindirh · · focus · HN ↗
From what I see is it's mainly managers and higher brass who doesn't care about code quality and sustainability, and aims to drive time to market metrics down aggressively with AI.
Any employee who cares about code quality will become a poor performer with a red luddite label because they dare to change what the AI has emitted for them.
I'd love to be wrong, very wrong about this, actually.
t43562 · · focus · HN ↗
Developers, however, are still responsible for the code! We must review the AI....all 80k lines of code it generated yesterday. If we don't then we are at fault. And we must go full throttle of course. So ....not be picky and retrograde about accepting what is generated.....
IOW we know who is going to get screwed and it isn't them.
hectdev · · focus · HN ↗
sanderjd · · focus · HN ↗
disgruntledphd2 · · focus · HN ↗
sanderjd · · focus · HN ↗
disgruntledphd2 · · focus · HN ↗
I didn't really make that point, so I have no opinion on that.
> Yeah but I mean, what is their compensation based on?
It's mostly just size of organisation and size of their book (the losses they are responsible for).
Like, all the risk is on the downside so they (AFAIK) don't tend to get huge bonuses for good performance.