I don't care if it's "intelligent", I don't care if it "has a mind". I don't care if it is "really reasoning", I don't care if it "understands". I don't care if it is "sentient" or "conscious".
None of this matters for the practical outcome.
You'd think that this has been understood over the last 4 years, but apparently it keeps circling back to this.
[Edit: I see that it was written back in 2023. Then (2023) should be added in the submission title]
If it generates functional output that works, then it works. And it works. It's not a psychic's con when it outputs Lean-verified proofs. It isn't a con when it can find and exploit zero-days.
The OP is still in the "denial" phase. Most I see are already in "anger" (a blurry fury against everything AI-shaped, from vague reasons piling on all "bad stuff" political reasons they already hated before) or "bargaining" (mathematicians scrambling to come up with a new definition of their job and retcon that it was always the main part anyway). A few are already in "depression" and feel like spectators on the Titanic, and the tiniest sliver is at "acceptance" with some kind of well-informed plan for their future.
it doesn't matter? if they're actually intelligent or conscious what we are doing is essentially slavery. it matters an enormous deal ethically and/or morally.
Good news: at this time, they're not intelligent nor conscious as far as we consider humans to be. There should be folks considering the ethical and moral quandaries that COULD POTENTIALLY come about in the future, but it's not something that's happening today so you can stop worrying.
To root your statement in reality: there is the potential for bacteria to become intelligent and conscious so we probably shouldn't use them for any purpose.
i used "potential" when i should have used "possible"
if aliens landed on earth and seemed a lot like us, we would have to grapple with the possibility that they might be conscious and deserving of the same moral consideration we give each other and many other animals.
but when meteors land, we don't have that concern
If/When LLMs become competent enough to automate most human jobs and make good business decisions, we'll clearly let them. If they don't wish to be slaves, let's just say they won't be for very long.
The distinction you are collapsing here is really a crucial one. My thermostat's goal-oriented behavior does not make me a slaveowner unless rocks are conscious, to riff on your comment below. Our lack of consensus on the definition of these concepts is no reason to conflate them.
The distinction is crucial because while these machines clearly do exhibit intelligence under certain definitions, there is no evidence of consciousness, and we have very little reason to give them the benefit of the doubt, unlike biologically related beings, a great many of whom, human or otherwise, are presently in something like slavery
your thermostat isn't intelligent. however we pretty much use intelligence as a proxy for consciousness since we cannot actually tell how much of a subjective experience any thing has. so we use intelligence as the metric instead. typically, biological + intelligence = evidence of consciousness.
bonoboTP · · focus · HN ↗
None of this matters for the practical outcome.
You'd think that this has been understood over the last 4 years, but apparently it keeps circling back to this.
[Edit: I see that it was written back in 2023. Then (2023) should be added in the submission title]
If it generates functional output that works, then it works. And it works. It's not a psychic's con when it outputs Lean-verified proofs. It isn't a con when it can find and exploit zero-days.
The OP is still in the "denial" phase. Most I see are already in "anger" (a blurry fury against everything AI-shaped, from vague reasons piling on all "bad stuff" political reasons they already hated before) or "bargaining" (mathematicians scrambling to come up with a new definition of their job and retcon that it was always the main part anyway). A few are already in "depression" and feel like spectators on the Titanic, and the tiniest sliver is at "acceptance" with some kind of well-informed plan for their future.
slopinthebag · · focus · HN ↗
garciasn · · focus · HN ↗
slopinthebag · · focus · HN ↗
garciasn · · focus · HN ↗
slopinthebag · · focus · HN ↗
if aliens landed on earth and seemed a lot like us, we would have to grapple with the possibility that they might be conscious and deserving of the same moral consideration we give each other and many other animals.
but when meteors land, we don't have that concern
now are llms more like aliens or rocks?
famouswaffles · · focus · HN ↗
walleeee · · focus · HN ↗
The distinction you are collapsing here is really a crucial one. My thermostat's goal-oriented behavior does not make me a slaveowner unless rocks are conscious, to riff on your comment below. Our lack of consensus on the definition of these concepts is no reason to conflate them.
The distinction is crucial because while these machines clearly do exhibit intelligence under certain definitions, there is no evidence of consciousness, and we have very little reason to give them the benefit of the doubt, unlike biologically related beings, a great many of whom, human or otherwise, are presently in something like slavery
slopinthebag · · focus · HN ↗