Thread

Canada welcomes EU proposal to become 'associate member'

284 points · 354 comments · witweb

delichon · 1789653589 · focus · HN ↗
Reaction from the Canadian opposition leader:
```
  The Prime Minister can’t seem to get his story straight about the “associate membership,” “unique alliance,” or whatever else he is negotiating with the EU.

  Conservatives are clear: we support the decades-old free trade &amp; NATO defence alliance with Europe.

  But no EU taxes, no EU laws, and no EU open-border immigration policies should be imposed on Canadians.

  Canada must be independent and sovereign. Period.
```
<a href="https://x.com/PierrePoilievre/status/2100274078066036766" rel="nofollow">https://x.com/PierrePoilievre/status/2100274078066036766
1. Maskawanian · 1789653814 · focus · HN ↗
  This is the same PP that grasped defeat in the face of victory, and is continually losing support, relegating himself to the same position of the Reform party that it was in the 90's. The same Polly that lost his riding last election, and had to have one handed to him on a silver spoon. I would take his opinion with a grain of salt.
  1. SketchySeaBeast · 1789654162 · focus · HN ↗
    Not just losing support, but his poor leadership managed to hand the liberals a majority months after the election.
2. MrGilbert · 1789653822 · focus · HN ↗
  > EU open-border immigration policies should be imposed on Canadians
  Not sure what's meant by that... People won't start swimming over the atlantic ocean. And flights to Canada aren't really cheap, by any means.
  1. AlexandrB · 1789654379 · focus · HN ↗
    Canada's net immigration (mostly from east Asia) was crazy high for a few years after COVID. Clearly enough people can afford the airfare.
    jpalawaga · 1789655558 · focus · HN ↗
    Canada doesn't have "open borders" or "free mobility" with "east asia" in the way that people are boogeymanning.
    The closest approximation is the united states under NAFTA.
    There is lots of poverty in America, but the border doesn't appear to have an issue. I fail to see how this would be much different (except more difficult due to an ocean and better security/screening checks on airport arrivals).
    triceratops · 1789656145 · focus · HN ↗
    Hang on you're saying people granted legal permission to fly to a country, specifically to immigrate to that country, also have the money to fly there? Crazy coincidence, that.
  2. gizajob · 1789656130 · focus · HN ↗
    What, €500 for a return flight? That’s millions of people with no money and no job able to fly to Canada and look for one - putting your hands on €500 isn’t impossible for anyone. The flights are so cheap as to be almost irrelevant for anyone motivated to go there. Plus Canadian wages are much higher, including tips. Getting a hospitality job in Canada pays about €500 a week in untaxed tips if you’re working hard anywhere half-decent. Or at least canadian wages are currently much higher - low skilled labour migrating there from the EU will push wages down and down, same as it always does.
3. victorbjorklund · 1789653950 · focus · HN ↗
  Schengen and EU isn’t the same.
  1. timbit42 · 1789854586 · focus · HN ↗
    There are so many things PP doesn't comprehend.
4. yreg · 1789653970 · focus · HN ↗
  Seems like he's attacking a bunch of strawmen.
  1. timbit42 · 1789854630 · focus · HN ↗
    Yep.
5. sicktriple · 1789654027 · focus · HN ↗
  Classic Conservative move of building a strawman and arguing against it. None of these deals would involve taxes, EU "laws" (whatever that means) or border agreements. He's using the boogeyman of "ew brown people" to scare his base.
  Apparently, even Canadian conservatives are happy to grovel at the feet of the Burger Reich and their supreme leader.
  1. 0862790842 · 1789655796 · focus · HN ↗
    [dead]
  2. rdm_blackhole · 1789656502 · focus · HN ↗
    > None of these deals would involve taxes, EU "laws" (whatever that means) or border agreements.
    It's a bit rich to say this when nothing yet is known.
    If Carney or the EU did not want the oppositions to start speculating regarding what it entails, maybe they should have talked about exactly what an associate membership means and what of sort of things could be expected from such a move.
    Maybe they are wrong or maybe you are and maybe it will involve EU taxes and EU regulations or maybe since you are absolutely certain of what it entails you have some sort of insider information that nobody else has?
    Until such a time as everyone knows and understand what a possible associate membership means for the EU and Canada, then nothing should be considered off the table and it is justified to ask questions and get some clarifications on all of this.
6. [deleted] · 1789654102 · focus · HN ↗
  [deleted]
7. AlexandrB · 1789654192 · focus · HN ↗
  He's not wrong. I have a suspicion this EU idea is a way to backdoor immigration increases - something the Trudeau government was very keen on but was scaled back by Carney. Largely because immigration has become a hot-button issue in Canada and was partly responsible for Polilievre's popularity last election. Joining a treaty where another governing body would set the criteria for immigration and Canada just has to accept it due to freedom of movement within the EU is one way to route around the whole thing politically and make it much harder to change in the future.
  If this is the motivation, it's a grossly undemocratic move.
  I don't get how folks who hyperventilate about Trump being a threat to democracy can look at stuff like this and cheer.
  1. donbox · 1789654496 · focus · HN ↗
    The free movement (if it is in picture) might be restricted to citizens. I think we need to wait for more details.
    AlexandrB · 1789654636 · focus · HN ↗
    Absolutely true. I suppose I'm just seeing the ways that this could be abused by our political leaders.
    fidotron · 1789655055 · focus · HN ↗
    The question is if it would allow all the wealthy Canadians to finally leave for Cyprus without paying exit taxes.
    donbox · 1789657005 · focus · HN ↗
    IMHO, it would be a win even if it allowed movement between Canada and the EU as freely as Canadians and Americans can currently move between Canada and the US. That would give Canadian snowbirds easier (longer) access to warm EU destinations, while those destinations would benefit from the additional revenue.
    fidotron · 1789657228 · focus · HN ↗
    In winter even the warm bits of the EU aren't all that warm either, and no one complains about the cold like a (non B.C.) Canadian encountering European winter humid cold for the first time.
    Europeans go to Thailand, even Latam etc. It's why so many were killed in the Indian Ocean tsunami.
  2. bryanlarsen · 1789655297 · focus · HN ↗
    Scaled back immigration happened under Trudeau just before Carney took over.
  3. nick_ · 1789659530 · focus · HN ↗
    > I don't get how folks who hyperventilate about Trump being a threat to democracy can look at stuff like this and cheer.
    It really stretches my imagination to the limit to see how your suspicion carries this move all the way to being comparable to what Trump has been doing.
8. simlevesque · 1789654226 · focus · HN ↗
  This guy isn't serious and should have resigned a long time ago. Zero credibility.
9. ChrisRR · 1789654424 · focus · HN ↗
  It sounds like they need to read what an associate membership is before they complain about it then
  1. AlexandrB · 1789654506 · focus · HN ↗
    It doesn't seem like anyone knows what it is yet since it's a new thing. But free movement of people for work is mentioned in almost every article about it.
    hedora · 1789657893 · focus · HN ↗
    It would need to be actually negotiated and stuff, but the opposition quote is just agreeing with all the public statements I have seen from the EU and Canadian leadership.
    So, I guess the opposition supports associate membership in everything but name.
  2. TheCapn · 1789655963 · focus · HN ↗
    This is Conservative playbook 101.
    It doesn't matter what the truth of the matter is. What Dear Leader says is used as a scare tactic and marching orders for the underlings to believe and repeat. If you live/interact with conservative people long enough you see the pattern. There's absolute trust in what their leadership says, but skepticism for any criticism of those same talking points.
    So all this tweet is doing is seeding doubt, and distrust among the electorate. It doesn't have to be true, but if the goal is to maintain control it looks like this. The Canadian Conservatives are still extremely pro-USA but have learned to keep their opinions close to the chest because they're currently politically unpoular.
10. pbkompasz · 1789654427 · focus · HN ↗
  > EU open-border immigration policies
  what's that?
  1. 468854259853 · 1789655642 · focus · HN ↗
    [dead]
11. 0x696C6961 · 1789655762 · focus · HN ↗
  This is what most people in canada think of PP <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ysqevg-jbAA" rel="nofollow">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ysqevg-jbAA
12. [deleted] · 1789656109 · focus · HN ↗
  [deleted]

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