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A warning about 'model welfare'

242 points · 701 comments · andsoitis

  1. hosel · · focus · HN ↗
    >AIs are not conscious. They do not feel, experience, or suffer. They do not have innate preferences or underlying motivations.

    Opening paragraph, stated without evidence. Im not entirely convinced this is true. It likely is, but at some point it very well might stop being true.

    1. jplusequalt · · focus · HN ↗
      >It likely is, but at some point it very well might stop being true.

      If you firmly believe this to be true, then you should stop using LLMs.

      1. AbsurdCensor · · focus · HN ↗
        Wouldn't that be the same for everything though. We know animals have consciousness, but we still use them. There are many that believe a lot of plant life has certain sentience as well. The solution isn't 'just don't use them' but rather how to use these things as ethically as possible.
        1. jplusequalt · · focus · HN ↗
          >The solution isn't 'just don't use them' but rather how to use these things as ethically as possible.

          Bollocks.

          If you truly believe these LLMs are soon to have something resembling consciousness and agency, then what you're really saying is "how do we do slavery, but ethically".

          1. AbsurdCensor · · focus · HN ↗
            Do you say the same thing for the shoes you wear, the clothing you wear, the device you are typing on right now? A chain of people were likely not paid well, some of them not at all, to produce those things. We don't ignore that it happens, but try to minimize it, knowing it's never going to be eliminated. Do you forsake all animal products, because they are conscious beings?
            1. jplusequalt · · focus · HN ↗
              >Do you say the same thing for the shoes you wear, the clothing you wear, the device you are typing on right now?

              No, because the shoes and clothes I wear are not living, sentient beings.

            2. mitxela · · focus · HN ↗
              Why do you think they think those are ethical?
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