Thread

1. tristanj · 1789527436 · focus · HN ↗

   Apple doesn't address the modified photo replay situation, where you take a picture of an already edited image.

   Photoshop / AI-gen an image -> display on a high-resolution monitor -> photograph the monitor with iPhone 18 Pro -> valid Apple Reference image.

   To get valid reference photos, you can go to the actual physical location, put the iPhone/monitor in a cardboard box to block external light, then photograph the monitor. Paint the inside of the box using Vantablack (stopping reflections) and cover the LiDAR projector with tape.

   I can't wait to see Apple Verified™ photos of UFOs flying over the Golden Gate Bridge.

   1. pveierland · 1789528538 · focus · HN ↗

      Claim 7 in this patent application describes how depth sensors are used as part of an image authentication process, which would make such a workaround more difficult:

      <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;image-ppubs.uspto.gov&#x2F;dirsearch-public&#x2F;print&#x2F;downloadPdf&#x2F;20260268025" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;image-ppubs.uspto.gov&#x2F;dirsearch-public&#x2F;print&#x2F;downloa...

      The Apple Reference Image feature is here launched on iPhone 18 Pro and iPhone 18 Pro Max that both have built-in LiDAR sensors that could be used for this process.

      1. BugsJustFindMe · 1789528800 · focus · HN ↗

         iPhone lidar only works up to like 16 feet in the easiest lighting conditions (indoors) and may be functionally ineffective outdoors.

         1. pveierland · 1789529375 · focus · HN ↗

            Still, that means that either the fake target scene and your screen presenting it would need to be outside of LiDAR sensor bounds, or you&#x27;d need to find a way to make the depth sensor data conform with your fake scene, both increasing the difficulty of producing a forgery.

            1. BugsJustFindMe · 1789533685 · focus · HN ↗

               <a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=49721878">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=49721878

               &gt; increasing the difficulty of producing a forgery

               The problem with this thinking is twofold:

               1) Whether it actually meaningfully increases the difficulty of a forgery remains to be seen. Despite their initial language about discerning real events, we see no details here about what scene information is used.

               2) It increases the potential value of a forgery because now your forgery is attested by Apple.

               So it either makes it easier to defraud people or more worthwhile to put in the effort to defraud people or both. None of those outcomes are great.

            2. moffkalast · 1789574468 · focus · HN ↗

               A sufficiently light absorbing material is indistinguishable from infinity to a lidar. Or simply add a mirror that redirects it sideways, those can&#x27;t be detected either.

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